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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Guy Icognito" data-source="post: 8058860" data-attributes="member: 7025748">Kay, so 5th ed is probably already more complicated than any other currently RPG on the market but Paizo’s. Small upgrades needed. Cause most people want a less complex game already, we’re talking indie product here. Rejiggering every class probably won’t work as that’s too much writing and balancing to really test. Releasing a 5th ed variant that is “5e but more broken” won’t work.The big places it needs more complexity is actions each round and levelling up.  Assuming a grid is step 1. Complexity and minis go together. Expanding the rules for using miniatures helps. Added rules for facing plus flanking (attacking from the sides) and attacking from the rear adds complexity. On each of your turns you’re not just moving, but choosing which way to face.There could be other limits. Like not being able to make attacks of opportunity on enemies behind your and turning to face enemies on your side when you AoO.Adding actions you can take each round can help. Like a fighting stance. Are you fighting aggressively or defensively or neutrally. Each round you tweak your AC/ attack as needed, giving you more options each turn.Codifying maneuvers also adds options. These could be used in place of an attack when able to make multiple attacks. This adds them to the ranger and paladin as well or any class that have the Extra Attack feature. Instead of attacking twice you attack and disarm or attack andBut I think most gamers just want more. More alternate class options. More options each level. More choice to customize. That isn’t really advanced 5th ed tho, just… more. Wizards sounds like they’re already doing that for the fall.To make that more advanced you’d wanna remember step 1 and make them really grid focused. Lots of 5 foot movement or shifting 1-2 squares. Look at 4th ed and it’s mobility powers.To make it actually advanced you could completely overhaul the feat system. Add new class features at the ability score boost levels (4, 8, 12). Maybe ones focused on exploration. Instead allow players to just pick a feat every odd levels. Doubles the number of feats. Make each feat half as powerful and have pre-reqs and feat chains.Needs feats that add actions as well. More attack options and powers.Should also be rules to add feats to monsters. Like 2 feats boosts its CR by 1. This makes monsters more interesting as well.</blockquote>

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