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General Tabletop Discussion
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition (A5E)
[+] What features should a "Advanced 5E" have?
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<blockquote data-quote="RangerWickett" data-source="post: 8060544" data-attributes="member: 63"><p>I'm going to edit this as I work on my idea. Last edited 9:30pm GMT 10 August 2020 with conditions. Still to do: martial tactics.</p><p></p><p><strong><span style="font-size: 18px">My Five Page Module for Advanced 5E Combat</span></strong></p><p>The game needs a small suite of narratively compelling combat conditions, and PC/monster design so they happen regularly.</p><p></p><p>I would, for instance, like rules for setting things on fire, and to have the damage be consistent - maybe with two conditions (e.g., 3 dmg/round Burning vs. 10 dmg/round Engulfed). I still want combat options to be balanced, and not to require a lot of extra dice rolling or cognitive load tracking complex conditions. But a dragon breath or fireball that does some up front damage and then sets you on fire is more dramatic than just flat damage.</p><p></p><p>Also, I'd like martial combat to let you, each turn, both attack and do something to adjust the conditions of the battle. But again, it's key not to make those conditions that complex. A small suite of regular tactics that people can internalize is best.</p><p></p><p>The game already has 'action' and 'bonus action,' so it would not be hard to design characters and monsters so your <em>action</em> each turn does damage, and your <em>bonus action</em> modulates the scenario.</p><p></p><p><strong>New Dying Rules</strong></p><p>I've slightly tweaked how dying would work, so that it better fits cinematic expectations. Characters can be mortally wounded, but still stick around long enough to have dying words. In the real world, even if you're on the ground bleeding, you usually take more than a few minutes to die, right?</p><p></p><p>In my version, reducing someone to 0 renders them helpless (prone, unable to act or move), but not dying. They get a save to remain conscious, so they can still talk weakly. If you attack them normally, you're probably just being cruel and wasteful, though you might crit them and cut something off or cause them to start bleeding. If you're bleeding or burning, you make death saving throws each turn. Also, someone can make a coup de grace; if you fail the save, you die, but if you succeed, they inflict a critical wound of their choice, which could be bleeding to kill you, or they could just mutilate you. </p><p></p><p>If you fail three death saves, you're moribund - you <em>will</em> die, barring 5th level magic, but you still have time to say your last words.</p><p></p><p><strong>Sample Condition Suite</strong></p><p>Bleeding*, Blinded, Burning*/Engulfed*, Deafened, Dominated*, Dying/Moribund*, Emotion* (Centered, Charmed, Dazed, Despairing, Frightened, Goaded, Horrified), Helpless, Incapacitated, Invisible, Prone, Restrained, Sickened*, Stunned, Unconscious, Wounded* (Eye, Limb, Mouth, Torso)</p><p></p><p><u>Bleeding</u> - Caused by evil blood magic, stirges (but only while attached), some critical hits. If you take any actions on your turn, you take damage equal to your level at the end of your turn. If you spend an action to make a Heal check (DC 10), success stops the bleeding; failure at least stanches it for a turn so you don't take any damage. <em>Cure wounds</em> spells automatically end bleeding.</p><p></p><p><u>Burning</u> - You take 3 damage at the end of your turn. You can spend an action to make a DC 10 Dex save to put out the fire. Make it with advantage if you're prone.</p><p><u>Engulfed </u>- You take 10 damage at the end of your turn. You can spend an action to make a DC 10 Dex save to reduce the condition to burning. Make it with advantage if you're prone.</p><p></p><p><u>Dominated</u> - What you'd expect, though I'm thinking of requiring most dominate effects to first have the target be affected by an emotion condition. Basically you need to get a foothold on someone's mind before you can fully control them. I want to set this up early so psionics and enchantment spells can be more than 'save or die.'</p><p></p><p><u>Moribund</u> - You will die in a few minutes, but can say a few words before you pass. You cannot heal hit points. This condition can be removed by some spells of 5th level or higher.</p><p></p><p><u>Emotion</u> - I was thinking of a way to combine social skills and combat, like with repartee. And a way to make mind-affecting attacks have to be a one-two punch, not just a knockout. Of course, there's a lot of need to balance these. A spell might make you despairing for a whole scene, while a Darth Vader esque intimidation might make you despair just for a round while he cuts down your friend.</p><p></p><ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Centered is the defensive one. If you're centered, an effect that would give you another emotion just removes centered. Monks might get this.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Charmed is same as normal.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Dazed means you can only take an action or bonus action on your turn, not both, and you can't take reactions. Hideous Laughter might do this.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Despairing means you won't take any actions unless you've been attacked or damaged in the past turn.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Frightened is same as normal, though this is specifically the panicked 'run away' sort of fear.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Goaded means you can't take any actions until you've attacked someone.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Horrified means you can't move at all <em>and</em> suffer disadvantage on things while you can see the source of your fear. Cthulhu monsters might do this.</li> </ul><p></p><p><u>Sickened</u> - This is just renamed Poisoned. You might suffer these conditions from a disease, a gut punch, or a poison.</p><p></p><p><u>Wounded</u> - I know wounds are controversial in D&D, but as my goal is to add some visceral narrative mechanics, I want a way for the occasional wound. Plus, well, the game already has spells called <em>cure wounds</em>, so let's make some.</p><p></p><p>Again, the idea of this combat system is to make combat have more narrative modulation. So instead of crits dealing more damage, they deal a condition. My short version goes like this.</p><p></p><p>1. Roll 1d6 to determine crit location. (1-2 leg, 3-4 arm, 5 chest, 6 head)</p><p>2. Leg wounds trip you then slow you until you heal.</p><p>3. Arm wounds disarm you and then keeps you from holding things with that limb. (We might also do something like impose a -2 penalty when attacking with a weapon in your off hand, unless you're ambidextrous).</p><p>4. Chest wounds cause bleeding.</p><p>5. Head wounds cause the blinded condition.</p><p>6. If the weapon is slashing, roll twice for location and pick which one you want. If the weapon is piercing, you can always inflict bleeding. If the weapon is bludgeoning and you hit the chest or head, you inflict the dazed condition lasting one round.</p><p></p><p>Normally, a wound is just a light wound, and can heal with a short rest or a level 1 <em>cure wounds</em> spell. If you suffer a crit and have no HP, it's a serious wound, which can heal with a long rest or a level 3 <em>cure wounds</em> spell. Certain special abilities, magic items, or making a coup de grace can cause a critical wound, which never heals naturally, and can only be recovered with a level 5 <em>cure wounds</em> spell.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="RangerWickett, post: 8060544, member: 63"] I'm going to edit this as I work on my idea. Last edited 9:30pm GMT 10 August 2020 with conditions. Still to do: martial tactics. [B][SIZE=5]My Five Page Module for Advanced 5E Combat[/SIZE][/B] The game needs a small suite of narratively compelling combat conditions, and PC/monster design so they happen regularly. I would, for instance, like rules for setting things on fire, and to have the damage be consistent - maybe with two conditions (e.g., 3 dmg/round Burning vs. 10 dmg/round Engulfed). I still want combat options to be balanced, and not to require a lot of extra dice rolling or cognitive load tracking complex conditions. But a dragon breath or fireball that does some up front damage and then sets you on fire is more dramatic than just flat damage. Also, I'd like martial combat to let you, each turn, both attack and do something to adjust the conditions of the battle. But again, it's key not to make those conditions that complex. A small suite of regular tactics that people can internalize is best. The game already has 'action' and 'bonus action,' so it would not be hard to design characters and monsters so your [I]action[/I] each turn does damage, and your [I]bonus action[/I] modulates the scenario. [B]New Dying Rules[/B] I've slightly tweaked how dying would work, so that it better fits cinematic expectations. Characters can be mortally wounded, but still stick around long enough to have dying words. In the real world, even if you're on the ground bleeding, you usually take more than a few minutes to die, right? In my version, reducing someone to 0 renders them helpless (prone, unable to act or move), but not dying. They get a save to remain conscious, so they can still talk weakly. If you attack them normally, you're probably just being cruel and wasteful, though you might crit them and cut something off or cause them to start bleeding. If you're bleeding or burning, you make death saving throws each turn. Also, someone can make a coup de grace; if you fail the save, you die, but if you succeed, they inflict a critical wound of their choice, which could be bleeding to kill you, or they could just mutilate you. If you fail three death saves, you're moribund - you [I]will[/I] die, barring 5th level magic, but you still have time to say your last words. [B]Sample Condition Suite[/B] Bleeding*, Blinded, Burning*/Engulfed*, Deafened, Dominated*, Dying/Moribund*, Emotion* (Centered, Charmed, Dazed, Despairing, Frightened, Goaded, Horrified), Helpless, Incapacitated, Invisible, Prone, Restrained, Sickened*, Stunned, Unconscious, Wounded* (Eye, Limb, Mouth, Torso) [U]Bleeding[/U] - Caused by evil blood magic, stirges (but only while attached), some critical hits. If you take any actions on your turn, you take damage equal to your level at the end of your turn. If you spend an action to make a Heal check (DC 10), success stops the bleeding; failure at least stanches it for a turn so you don't take any damage. [I]Cure wounds[/I] spells automatically end bleeding. [U]Burning[/U] - You take 3 damage at the end of your turn. You can spend an action to make a DC 10 Dex save to put out the fire. Make it with advantage if you're prone. [U]Engulfed [/U]- You take 10 damage at the end of your turn. You can spend an action to make a DC 10 Dex save to reduce the condition to burning. Make it with advantage if you're prone. [U]Dominated[/U] - What you'd expect, though I'm thinking of requiring most dominate effects to first have the target be affected by an emotion condition. Basically you need to get a foothold on someone's mind before you can fully control them. I want to set this up early so psionics and enchantment spells can be more than 'save or die.' [U]Moribund[/U] - You will die in a few minutes, but can say a few words before you pass. You cannot heal hit points. This condition can be removed by some spells of 5th level or higher. [U]Emotion[/U] - I was thinking of a way to combine social skills and combat, like with repartee. And a way to make mind-affecting attacks have to be a one-two punch, not just a knockout. Of course, there's a lot of need to balance these. A spell might make you despairing for a whole scene, while a Darth Vader esque intimidation might make you despair just for a round while he cuts down your friend. [LIST] [*]Centered is the defensive one. If you're centered, an effect that would give you another emotion just removes centered. Monks might get this. [*]Charmed is same as normal. [*]Dazed means you can only take an action or bonus action on your turn, not both, and you can't take reactions. Hideous Laughter might do this. [*]Despairing means you won't take any actions unless you've been attacked or damaged in the past turn. [*]Frightened is same as normal, though this is specifically the panicked 'run away' sort of fear. [*]Goaded means you can't take any actions until you've attacked someone. [*]Horrified means you can't move at all [I]and[/I] suffer disadvantage on things while you can see the source of your fear. Cthulhu monsters might do this. [/LIST] [U]Sickened[/U] - This is just renamed Poisoned. You might suffer these conditions from a disease, a gut punch, or a poison. [U]Wounded[/U] - I know wounds are controversial in D&D, but as my goal is to add some visceral narrative mechanics, I want a way for the occasional wound. Plus, well, the game already has spells called [I]cure wounds[/I], so let's make some. Again, the idea of this combat system is to make combat have more narrative modulation. So instead of crits dealing more damage, they deal a condition. My short version goes like this. 1. Roll 1d6 to determine crit location. (1-2 leg, 3-4 arm, 5 chest, 6 head) 2. Leg wounds trip you then slow you until you heal. 3. Arm wounds disarm you and then keeps you from holding things with that limb. (We might also do something like impose a -2 penalty when attacking with a weapon in your off hand, unless you're ambidextrous). 4. Chest wounds cause bleeding. 5. Head wounds cause the blinded condition. 6. If the weapon is slashing, roll twice for location and pick which one you want. If the weapon is piercing, you can always inflict bleeding. If the weapon is bludgeoning and you hit the chest or head, you inflict the dazed condition lasting one round. Normally, a wound is just a light wound, and can heal with a short rest or a level 1 [I]cure wounds[/I] spell. If you suffer a crit and have no HP, it's a serious wound, which can heal with a long rest or a level 3 [I]cure wounds[/I] spell. Certain special abilities, magic items, or making a coup de grace can cause a critical wound, which never heals naturally, and can only be recovered with a level 5 [I]cure wounds[/I] spell. [/QUOTE]
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