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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Chaosmancer" data-source="post: 9278817" data-attributes="member: 6801228">Are you just trolling me at this point? You keep saying you understand the concept, then you say nonsensical things like this that make me think you truly don't get it. What design space? What design space are you even possibly talking about? The same design space that says the Church of the Silver Flame worships the Silver Flame? That the City of Waterdeep is ruled by masked lords and a single open lord? Is that the design space? Because it is the only design space that matters when you are building a fictional conceit of a setting and world. You want me give examples? Junge is a level 5 [Fruit Farmer] from this he has high endurance and his crops do not naturally wither. He also got the ability to hybridize his fruits, leading to unique foods for his village. Sam is a level 2 [Smith] and he knows his specialization comes next level. He's been working hard making armor and weapons, hoping to become either a [Weapon Smith] or an [Armor smith] but he's also heard that if you can figure out this thing called "clockwork" like the gnomes do, you can have even rarer smith specialties. Tusk Azureblood is a level 13 [Skydancer of Orm] and can summon storms with her dances, or turn into an ethereal wind spirit. Tales say that at her last performance she lifted the entire audience to dance in the sky with her. Fitz is a level 4 [Thief Rogue], he's good in a scrape and has run from a lot of the more dangerous elements of the city. He's slippery and seemed to pick up the ability to vanish into shadows. But he's come to the party worried, because a part of his gang is gone missing, and there are disturbing rumors in the lower city. Sure, I could have done this instead: Junge: Farmer+2 Con +1 Wis, +3 ProfNature, Animal HandlingLand VehiclesMagic Initiate: DruidSam: Smith+2 con, +1 Str, +2 profInvestigation, HistorySmith's ToolsCrafterTusk Aureblood: Skydancer+2 Cha, +1 Dex, +4 profPerformance, NatureDisguise KitInspiring Leader, Actor, Magic Initiate: ClericFitz: Thieves+2 Dex, +1 Wis, +2 profStealth, Sleight of HandThieve's ToolsSkulkerBut these things? These things are not story elements. None of this tells a story in the same way as what I wrote above did. And guess what else? I don't need to design mechanical classes with levels and distinct abilities. No one wants to play a Skydancer of Orm? Great! Because they can't anyways, to gain access to the class you need to outdance the wind during a thunderstorm on top of a mountain and gain the blessings of Orm. It has no combat abilities that make people want it? Why would it? It is a class designed for sacred dances and performances, It doesn't need to be able to fight dragons, that isn't the point of it. And if a player really wants to do this? If they see this and they want it? Then I can work on some abilities then, but I can tailor what they get and if it doesn't give them combat power? Well... they likely didn't want to be a sacred dancer to a storm god because it made them better at fighting dragons. Stop. Approaching.This.Mechanically.This isn't a question of mechanics. It isn't a question of class design. This isn't a question of what players want or what is a waste of the DMs energy. If they want to have Tusk [Skydancer of Orm] get involved in a fight? Then sure, make a statblock for the fight then. But in-universe, in the story, in the reality of the fictional world? She has a class, a class with levels and abilities and skills and feats. Because in this world, EVERYONE has a class.</blockquote>

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