What is "railroading" to you (as a player)?

[Bill Zebub]

That is a reflection of the stat, so yes. It's ignoring the stat because it's inconvenient that I take issue with.

If I had a Dex 6, would you expect me to weave that into my roleplaying as well, for example by narrating tripping over things, spilling beer mugs, and other things that add color but don't actually affect the game? And by "expect" I mean: if I didn't do those things, if my low Dex never came up except when I attempted Dexterity-dependent actions (ranged attacks, making saving throws, stealthing, etc.), would you criticize my roleplaying?

 

[Micah Sweet]

Why are you demanding justification from one player but not the other?

And what good does it do? Let's say Jeff is the kind of player who would resort to low-down stinking cheating by coming up with ideas that his moronic character (defined by the -5% penalty to Intelligence checks). So we police his thinking by demanding he justify how his character could possibly have thought to let air out of the tires of the truck stuck under the bridge. If he's the kind of player who destroy everybody's fun so callously, then he's just going to make something up. "Uhh....I was in my remedial Walking & Chewing Gum at the Same Time class, and the teacher told us about it. I wrote it down on a piece of paper so I wouldn't forget, and it's been in my pocket for the last 11 years."

What's next? Do the other players then police the justification, and vote on whether it's good enough?

Coming up with that story is roleplaying their PC.

 

[Micah Sweet]

If I had a Dex 6, would you expect me to weave that into my roleplaying as well, for example by narrating tripping over things, spilling beer mugs, and other things that add color but don't actually affect the game? And by "expect" I mean: if I didn't do those things, if my low Dex never came up except when I attempted Dexterity-dependent actions (ranged attacks, making saving throws, stealthing, etc.), would you criticize my roleplaying?

Yes, if you had a low Dex I would want to see that come out in role-playing. Why wouldn't I?

 

[FrozenNorth]

If you want to play a character as smart as you are, pick an appropriate Intelligence. There can be room for disagreement, but when they guy making all the detailed plans is the one with a D&D INT of 8, I think I'm going to question whether the player is actually playing the character in the first place. As I said, if you want to do token play, play a game without mental and social attributes.

The question is « who decides whether an Int 8 character is smart enough to toss a pebble to distract the guard? ». The rules are pretty clear that the decision is supposed to be the purview of the person who plays the character.

 

[AnotherGuy]

Why are you demanding justification from one player but not the other?

The idea behind the system is
If you are not proficient with a skill and you roll exceptionally well, perhaps beating another who is proficient then the GM may request an explanation. You don't have to do this all the time because that can get exhausting. Sometimes the GM offers one in the narrative.

Now I'm saying you can expand that idea to abilities.
Low INT but comes up with a bright idea (player's idea).
Low CHA but speaks beautifully (player's words).
Low WIS but does not move towards the heap of gold (player exercising strong willpower on behalf of the character)

And what good does it do? Let's say Jeff is the kind of player who would resort to low-down stinking cheating by coming up with ideas that his moronic character (defined by the -5% penalty to Intelligence checks). So we police his thinking by demanding he justify how his character could possibly have thought to let air out of the tires of the truck stuck under the bridge. If he's the kind of player who destroy everybody's fun so callously, then he's just going to make something up. "Uhh....I was in my remedial Walking & Chewing Gum at the Same Time class, and the teacher told us about it. I wrote it down on a piece of paper so I wouldn't forget, and it's been in my pocket for the last 11 years."

What's next? Do the other players then police the justification, and vote on whether it's good enough?

Actually YES!
Particularly if I disagree with a player on an issue which affects our immersion/internal consistency/coherency. The entire table usually also offers input to challenge one of our perceptions.
If that does not work, it gets to a vote.
This has only happened twice in the last 10 years and the table sided with me.
By the way it was the same player - both times.

EDIT: I should mention the first time it was the use of a Plot Point (first and last time) where he was pushing the boundaries of the meta-currency.

 

[Bill Zebub]

Yes, if you had a low Dex I would want to see that come out in role-playing. Why wouldn't I?

Huh.

There are so MANY potential ways to roleplay a character, most of which don't really have anything to do with attributes. Personality quirks, phobias, cravings, addictions, fetishes, habits, mannerisms, physical descriptions, speech patterns, signature sayings, etc.

And, sure, leaning into a stat can also be good fodder.

But emphasizing that a player must be roleplaying all six of their stats? That just feels....narrow.

 

[hawkeyefan]

You can't ignore it on die rolls without cheating. Not the same thing.

But what does “ignoring it other than on die rolls” even mean?

How do you quantify it in a way that’s satisfactory? How different is an 8 from a 10?

Yes, if you had a low Dex I would want to see that come out in role-playing. Why wouldn't I?

One would hope there are better opportunities for roleplaying besides pretending to drop a torch and then remarking on how big a klutz you are!

 

[Micah Sweet]

The question is « who decides whether an Int 8 character is smart enough to toss a pebble to distract the guard? ». The rules are pretty clear that the decision is supposed to be the purview of the person who plays the character.

I think it's unlikely this would ever be an issue unless there was a pretty big, obvious gap between the behavior and the stat on the page. Fancy speech from the Player on behalf of their low-Charisma character, for example.

 

[Bill Zebub]

Fancy speech from the Player on behalf of their low-Charisma character, for example.

In real life, fancy speech from a low charisma person can be very entertaining. It can even help explain their low charisma.

 

[Micah Sweet]

Huh.

There are so MANY potential ways to roleplay a character, most of which don't really have anything to do with attributes. Personality quirks, phobias, cravings, addictions, fetishes, habits, mannerisms, physical descriptions, speech patterns, signature sayings, etc.

And, sure, leaning into a stat can also be good fodder.

But emphasizing that a player must be roleplaying all six of their stats? That just feels....narrow.

Tell me why they're there then. Are they intended as nothing more than modifiers to specific die rolls? They're not everything of course, but IMO they should be something.