What is "railroading" to you (as a player)?

[Fenris-77]

There's a reason I specified my game. After all rolls are said and done, the player can swap any two stat numbers. The only way for a PC to end up with a low intelligence in my game is to pick it, and if he picks it, I expect him to roleplay it.

It's still really easy to get stuck with the bad INT here and not have 'picked it'. People swap stats to move good stats into places they need them. Or do you mean I should swap out for a better INT instead of improving my fighters STR or CON because you have a bee in your bonnet about people needing to RP their crap stats?

I think that when you say 'roleplay' it there are going to be some fights. One, it sounds like you're being a bit of a jerk about it (could just be phrasing), and two, you sound like you think you get to pick what roleplaying looks like for other people, which is a bit sticky. I mean I guess you can kick people out of your game for failing your roleplay you worst stat or else test, but I don't think it's that important.

 

[Micah Sweet]

Some games give 3d6 down the line with no do-overs. I'm not busting a nut to lean into being an idiot when that idiotness was randomly assigned. If someone picks the low INT number that's different, then we're probably talking about an annoying white-room optimizer type.

See to me, you play what you roll, if that's the game you decided to play.

 

[Maxperson]

I think this discussion is actually about immersion for some folks -- the dumb PC coming up with smart ideas by way of the player breaks that immersion. I get that. Folks should definitely play with people that support their personal preferred playstyles, including immersion.

I played D&D for 20ish years with someone who probably had an 8 intelligence. It took him a long time to come up with ideas in new situations. One time we were fighting a demon lord and his character was literally dead on the demon lords next turn and no healer had a turn before then. My turn came up and I looked at my sheet and in just a few seconds I announced I was using a limited wish spell to move my Ring of Nine Lives unto his character's finger. The demon lord took him to 0, and the ring cast heal on him. It saved his life.

After the game he asked me if I came up with that on the spot(there was no other way to come up with it). When I told him yes he said, "If I could even think of something like that, it would take me days to figure it out." After that I started paying attention when I dealt with people. Smart people, slow people, and average people.

The biggest differentiator in intelligence was processing speed. The slow person can generally get to where the smart person got, but it usually takes a lot longer. I think that's why people(both the slow and the gifted) think that slow people can't think of things. Humans often quit when things are hard, and slow people will often give up before they reach the answer. If they persevered they'd have gotten there, but they didn't.

The above is why I have no problem with a low intelligence PC once in a while coming up with a good idea quickly. Someone who is slow has to consider the options and sometimes they will start with the right one. It's only when they are consistently roleplaying a slow PC as quick witted that I have an issue with the roleplay.

That said, I will never veto what a player has his PC do. If the roleplay is consistently above the PCs 8 intelligence, I will talk to the player privately outside of the game about his roleplaying of the stat. My group enjoys roleplaying the entire character, flaws and all, and someone flaunting a flaw like that is going to affect the group's enjoyment.

 

[Maxperson]

It's still really easy to get stuck with the bad INT here and not have 'picked it'. People swap stats to move good stats into places they need them. Or do you mean I should swap out for a better INT instead of improving my fighters STR or CON because you have a bee in your bonnet about people needing to RP their crap stats?

I think that when you say 'roleplay' it there are going to be some fights. One, it sounds like you're being a bit of a jerk about it (could just be phrasing), and two, you sound like you think you get to pick what roleplaying looks like for other people, which is a bit sticky. I mean I guess you can kick people out of your game for failing your roleplay you worst stat or else test, but I don't think it's that important.

The way we roll stats, it's just not the issue you make it out to be.

 

[Fenris-77]

See to me, you play what you roll, if that's the game you decided to play.

Yeah, and past a point you can kiss my lily-white goblin if you think you get to tell me how to do that. I'm playing the game for my own enjoyment, not to pass someone else's test about what the game is supposed to be. That's the real issue here, you both think you know best and that you get to tell people they are having their fun wrong. Sorry dude, it doesn't work like that.

That's not to say that people purposefully slotting low INT and then roleplaying isn't annoying sometimes, sure it is. However, the decision each of gets to make is whom to play with. We don't get to tell people how to have their fun. Think for a moment how you would react if someone you were playing with got up in your face about how you were playing your character all wrong and needed to do X or Y (this is rhetorical, we all know you'd be pissed).

 

[Fenris-77]

The way we roll stats, it's just not the issue you make it out to be.

Not until you start jumping on people for not leaning into the parts of their character that aren't important and that they didn't pick. Which is exactly what you're doing. Maybe just stop trying to tell people how to play their characters and just worry about how you play your character?

 

[GrimCo]

Well, in some cases, its not a hypothetical. People trying to sidestep their in-character social or intellectual lacks has not exactly been a massive rarity in the hobby. At least in my case, those are the only cases I'm really talking about.

I've seen this numerous times over the years. Done it myself also numerous times. Problem is, in D&D from 3x onwards, average being 10-11, anything above is above average (duh), but what's the difference between say 12 and 16 in practical sense outside mechanics, is hard. To correlate to real life iq. For all intense and purposes, in everyday life, there is little practical difference between iq 120 and 140. Uneducated high iq person can sound dumb, and highly educated average iq person can sound smart, depending on the situation of course.