What is the difference between push, pull, shift and slide?

[Sir Brennen]

An example which shows that push/pull isn't always a physical action is one of the previewed spells (don't remember the name), where the target basically is reacting to a phantasm in their mind the caster creates, and stumbles about (slides) in the direction the caster chooses as they continue to manipulate the target through the illusion.

So, a push/pull/slide effect can probably be achieved by a number of different types of powers and methods, but since the end result is forced movement of some type, it's all been consolidated under these terms.

 

[Rykaar]

Each square of a pull has to move the target closer to the puller. Each square of a push has to move the target further from the pusher. In fact, you can't even use pull on an enemy adjacent to you, because there's nowhere to pull the enemy that is (1) closer to you, (2) without being the square you're in.

Hmm...the horror movie setup where the victim is dragged away screaming seems unlikely if you can't pull them with you (i.e. you move away, they stay adjacent).

Likewise a push when they're supposed to move further away from you is a shove. I think the quintessential push is a shield push (go watch 300, then report back) which involves you gaining ground at the expense of your foe losing ground.

And combined pull/push? That'd be a judo throw.

I'm really just playing devil's advocate with the above. I don't know yet how the mechanics will really play out, not having playtested 4e in any of its currently available forms.

 

[Jeff Wilder]

I'm really just playing devil's advocate with the above. I don't know yet how the mechanics will really play out, not having playtested 4e in any of its currently available forms.

There may well be pushes and pulls in which the attacker has a movement component as well. But smart money's on those being the exception, rather than the rule. The new minis game adheres pretty closely to 4E combat rules, so far.

 

[Raziel1845]

I do think it will be possible to pull someone who is adjacent to you cause of this.

XAX
XBX
XXX

XXX
ABX
XXX

B pulled A to his side (and notice A is not any closer to B than he was before). Now I don't know that B would be able to push A in that direction.

 

[Majoru Oakheart]

I do think it will be possible to pull someone who is adjacent to you cause of this.

Nope, once a creature is adjacent to you, there is no way to pull them. There is no square closer than the one they are already in.

 

[thatdarnedbob]

Hmm...the horror movie setup where the victim is dragged away screaming seems unlikely if you can't pull them with you (i.e. you move away, they stay adjacent).

Likewise a push when they're supposed to move further away from you is a shove. I think the quintessential push is a shield push (go watch 300, then report back) which involves you gaining ground at the expense of your foe losing ground.

Push an enemy 1 square, then shift or move up to them. "Problem" solved.

 

[eleran]

I haven't seen any examples of pulling in melee. If you push, I don't see why you'd have to follow them (with bull rush you have to, but that may not be the general rule).

Take a look at the Goblin Picador. He is the one with the Harpoon. If he hits with the Harpoon he can start pulling the hit character around the battlefield. The guy with the harpoon in his shoulder can try to break free with a STR vs Fort check.

 

[D'karr]

Nope, once a creature is adjacent to you, there is no way to pull them. There is no square closer than the one they are already in.

That is correct.

However, in a situation in which you want to continue "pulling" the other creature what you are really doing is using a move action to move your character and a standard action to pull the creature. So you can continue doing this as long as the creature or it's friends doesn't whack the heck out of you on it's turn.

 

[Gloombunny]

There could still be a power where you grab an enemy and move them through or around your square; it would just have to be defined as a slide instead of a pull.

 

[ZombieRoboNinja]

Take a look at the Goblin Picador. He is the one with the Harpoon. If he hits with the Harpoon he can start pulling the hit character around the battlefield. The guy with the harpoon in his shoulder can try to break free with a STR vs Fort check.

GET OVER HERE!

</mortalkombat>