D&D 4E WHat should be random in 4E?

[Thurbane]

A lot of people are calling for non-random ability scores and non-random hit points, just wondering what the general feelings are for what should be random and what should be non-random?

 

[Nifft]

I voted "yes" for Saving Throws, but I really think Saving Throws should be rolled up into Defenses.

Cheers, -- N

 

[Aust Diamondew]

Like Nifft I think saving throws should be random in that you roll to beat them. So the result is randomized but the die rolled by the 'attacker'.

I think the other stuff to be random should be optional. As a GM I haven't randomly done HP/Abilities for NPCs or monsters I intended the PCs to fight for many years.

 

[Jackelope King]

These should be random, as they take place within the context of challenges in the game:

* Weapon Damage Rolls
* Spell Damage Rolls
* To Hit Rolls
* Skill/Ability Checks

Saving throws should probably also be added in here, but as I suspect that they'll become defenses with the attacker rolling to overcome them, I didn't vote for them.

Everything else is the domain of character creation, which is the other aspect of roleplaying which need not be random, and in fact went building specific, detailed characters, the system tends to suffer from it.*

* (But that's not to say I mind using random character too much, but usually only when I don't have a specific, detailed character in mind. As a DM, for instance, I've determined the hit points for critters like goblins by just rolling a handful of d6s and then ticking them off on the dice when the gobbies take damage. Sometimes I'll randomly generate NPC ability scores, but usually it's easiest to just give them a 14 if they're good with an ability score or 18 if they're really good with it. Then again, these aren't specific, detailed characters... they're background noise slash cannon fodder at best )

 

[Atlatl Jones]

I don't want random hit points. They serve no useful purpose. For ability scores, I want there to be both random and point-buy options, all listed in the PHB with a note that the DM decides which to use.

 

[drothgery]

I voted "yes" for Saving Throws, but I really think Saving Throws should be rolled up into Defenses.

Cheers, -- N

Using the logic that they will be, I voted no there.

 

[Pygon]

I've had problems with random PC abilities (too high!), but random PC hit points at least makes them somewhat personal.

Saving throws, ability checks, attack rolls and damage should be random. They make up the challenges that PC's face.

 

[MoogleEmpMog]

Weapon damage.
Spell damage.
Attack rolls.
Skill/ability checks.

I leave 'saving throws' off because I'd much prefer to see those as target numbers against which active characters would make rolls. To be fair, though, this would leave the results just as random.

Now, I would very much like to see a lot LESS randomness in all four of the above types, but I recognize my reasons for that as being somewhat personal and not widely applicable.

In general, if something is PERSISTENT (hp, ability scores), I don't want it to be random. If it is INSTANTANEOUS or has a short DURATION (attacks, spells, skills, ability checks), randomization is fine, because it will tend to average out over the course of a campaign.

 

[reanjr]

Wow, I'm totally inline with everyone else except on Monster HP. I don't like the player's counting down an opponent's HP so I prefer random HP for monsters. I think a perfect way to do it would be (in the context of 3e's rules) 1 full HD + 75% avg. HD + 25% random HD (rounded down, min 1):

d8 examples:
1 HD 8
2-7 HD 8 + (HD - 2) * 4.5 + 1d8
8-11 HD 8 + (HD - 3) * 4.5 + 2d8
etc.

 

[reanjr]

I don't want random hit points. They serve no useful purpose. For ability scores, I want there to be both random and point-buy options, all listed in the PHB with a note that the DM decides which to use.

What's wrong with 3e's system of applying the same logic to HP, except placing it in the player's control? Random HP server the same useful purpose that random ability scores do: differenting characters whose players wish to have them created more "organically".