D&D (2024) What should be the Optimization and Magic Item Assumption of PCs be?

[Minigiant]

There are a lot of conversation about classes and races.

However I think that there isn't enough discussion on the other side of the board: The monsters. And how they are out of wack with the PCs

And, to me, it all comes down to the assumption of what the PCs have to bring against them. We did a playtest and more or less agreed to assume the PCs would have moderate optimization and not have magic items factored into power. Then we played 5e with most tables being widely optimized between joke and super with most tables handing out numerical bonus magic. (This before we looked at the poorly designed monsters and not even following CR)

And 1DND characters are (or will be) getting stronger races origins and classes along with a better feat system.

So should One D&D even use the same PC assumptions as 5e?

5e's CR is broken anyway and most of the monsters don't follow the guidelines.

 

[Horwath]

Last option for vote should be heavy optimization and MANY numerical bonus.

 

[Horwath]

on topic,

I would design CR with heavy optimization in calculation, with some magic item bonuses.

I would however remove all +X magic bonuses to attack, DC, AC, saves.
Only special effects and damage bonuses. Damage reduction, resistances and similar.
To keep bounded accuracy really bounded.

 

[James Gasik]

I'm going to go with low optimization and many magic items. New players aren't going to know jack about optimization, and that's how we balanced things in AD&D. Player has terrible character? Here, have a +1 sword, +2 armor, and Gauntlets of Ogre Power! Now you're an elite Fighter!

 

[cranberry]

I agree with James. It took me a while to get used to 5E where PCs gained magic like abilities simply by leveling up. I prefer the 1E way of using magic items to enhance power, as it gives the DM another tool in balancing encounters.

 

[FireLance]

Other:
Narrow the power gap between the least optimized PC and the most optimized PC and make the magic item math so simple and transparent that it is trivially easy for the DM to adjust for whatever magic items he does or doesn't hand out. It's 4lrEady been done, you know.

 

[CreamCloud0]

the difference between low optimisation-high bonuses and high optimisation-no bonuses it'd be like a champion fighter with a +5 headband of intelect vs one with a +0 flaming longsword right?
EDIT: or is this optimisation of the character separately considered from their magic items? so healer feat fighter vs GWF greatsword fighter alongside the separate consideration of having a +0 vs +5 flaming longsword

 

[Horwath]

I'm going to go with low optimization and many magic items. New players aren't going to know jack about optimization, and that's how we balanced things in AD&D. Player has terrible character? Here, have a +1 sword, +2 armor, and Gauntlets of Ogre Power! Now you're an elite Fighter!

That could be a problem if you have two characters that can use those swords and armors.
I would rather give +1 sword to a fighter with 20 STR than to one with 14 STR.

 

[aco175]

I'm going to go with low optimization and many magic items. New players aren't going to know jack about optimization, and that's how we balanced things in AD&D. Player has terrible character? Here, have a +1 sword, +2 armor, and Gauntlets of Ogre Power! Now you're an elite Fighter!

I voted heavy optimization/low magic for the same reason. I was thinking that new players could get the magic to make up for the players that optimize. The monsters are made for the optimizers though to make that game work and if you had a normal Pc and a magic something, then that would bump you to more optimized and on-par with the others.

Then the problem might be having optimizers gain the magic and become super. In my games, we tend to not play with feats except some of the lesser ones like mobility or extra languages. Nobody has taken the big ones like GWM or PAM to make combat a cakewalk so I have cooler items that are handed out like 2e times.

 

[Krachek]

I don‘t look for a sharp balance in DnD.
I won’t ask sharp balance from a game who propose rolled stats as primary way to build a character!
So having a rough balance for no Magic and honest build is quite enough.
If I need to be challenged on tactical and optimization level I would rather play a card game or any other PvP game.