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<blockquote data-quote="delericho" data-source="post: 6069333" data-attributes="member: 22424">This is, indeed, an issue. Actually, I thought WotC got their level range and deities spot on with 4e - the gods were killable, but only by the highest level PCs and if the circumstances were just right. (Certainly, it was better than 3e with both gods and epic levels having systems, those systems being almost entirely incompatible, and neither being very good.)The only real way I can see the system working with both open-ended levels and fixed stats for gods is if the game also declares that characters who reach or exceed level X (for an appropriate value of X) are, in fact, already gods themselves. In which case, that 40th level &quot;greater god of magic&quot; may well have lost his mantle once that PC wizard hit level 41.I used to agree, but I think I've become a convert to the &quot;tiers as treasure&quot; idea that has occasionally been mooted here. Because while the solution you suggest has a certain elegance, the truth is that very very few people play at high levels - so few that they're not worth WotC's time supporting them. But those same levels are the ones most in need of support, and so without it fewer people play, and so...Basically, anything above level 13ish in 3e and above 20ish in 4e is largely wasted space for the majority of groups, because while it's nice to dream of those capstone powers you'll eventually get to wield, and drool over those awesome monsters the DM will eventually throw at his players, the reality is that you probably never will get to use those powers or monsters. As Rel says, far better for the game to help make you awesome now.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="delericho, post: 6069333, member: 22424"] This is, indeed, an issue. Actually, I thought WotC got their level range and deities spot on with 4e - the gods were killable, but only by the highest level PCs and if the circumstances were just right. (Certainly, it was better than 3e with both gods and epic levels having systems, those systems being almost entirely incompatible, and neither being very good.) The only real way I can see the system working with both open-ended levels and fixed stats for gods is if the game [i]also[/i] declares that characters who reach or exceed level X (for an appropriate value of X) are, in fact, already gods themselves. In which case, that 40th level "greater god of magic" may well have lost his mantle once that PC wizard hit level 41. I used to agree, but I think I've become a convert to the "tiers as treasure" idea that has occasionally been mooted here. Because while the solution you suggest has a certain elegance, the truth is that very very few people play at high levels - so few that they're not worth WotC's time supporting them. But those same levels are the ones most in need of support, and so without it fewer people play, and so... Basically, anything above level 13ish in 3e and above 20ish in 4e is largely wasted space for the majority of groups, because while it's nice to dream of those capstone powers you'll eventually get to wield, and drool over those awesome monsters the DM will eventually throw at his players, the reality is that you [i]probably never will[/i] get to use those powers or monsters. As Rel says, far better for the game to help make you awesome now. [/QUOTE]

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