What Would a 4e Mystara Look Like?

[Remathilis]

Well, depends on what element's you're emphasizing...

Some elements of Mystara are unique (others have pointed out skyships, red steel, and the Hollow World) but a LOT of Mystara is "X culture with the name filed off". The Northlands (Soderfjord, Vestlands and Ostland) are pretty much analgous to the Scandinavians, Thyatis is a medieval version of Ancient Rome, Ylaruam is fantasy Arabia, Karameikos is a Roman invasion of the Balkins, Ethengar is Mongolia, Heldann Freeholds is Iceland, Darokin is Venice, Minrothand Guilds is Switzerland, and that doesn't EVEN touch the mish-mash that is the Hollow World (From Ancient Egypt to Pirates of the Caribbean!) Even the demi-human nations (Alfheim, Rockhome, and the Five Shires) feel like they could called Rivendell, Moria, and the Shire.

Going by WotC's treatment of the "X culture with name filed off" in the 4e Realms, I don't think there would be enough of Mystara left to put a toe-tag on! WotC's best bet is to borrow elements for its Nerath setting (like the Isle of Dread) and leave the rest untouched; those who like it have it, and what WotC would do to it wouldn't even be worth it.

 

[ExploderWizard]

Cool Any stuff about your campaign available online?

Have you checked out the Mystara 4E Conversion project?

And the Mystara 4E Monsterous Compendium I?

-Havard

Nothing formalized enough to make decent reading for others. Yes I have looked at those resources. The monster conversions have been very helpful.

I'm focusing this campaign on the tensions between the Thyatian and Traldaran cultures. I set the start date of the campaign at 1025 but decided not to use a bunch of 'official' stuff between 1000-1025 instead filling in my own events and happenings.

I have repurposed the Isle of Dread for this campaign. Precious minerals have been discovered there and the Thyatians have taken control of the isle and has forbidden any outside exploration. Of course they wouldn't want nosy adventurers there seeing as their work camps are filled with Traladaran slaves aquired through the Iron Ring.

I just really like that the world can work great as a 'regular' fantasy campaign world yet a ton of wild wahoo elements like skyships can be used and somehow it all seems to fit together.

 

[Dragonhelm]

Do you really think that yet another vanilla fantasy setting could compete? I don't. Other than yet another nostalgia product, a new fantasy setting needs more than aging fans to prop it up.

This goes along with my concerns about Greyhawk.

The problem here is that even if Mystara could compete, look who it would compete with - the Realms. You don't put out product that competes with your own product.

Now, I don't know Mystara very well, but my understanding is that it's a cross of some old-school modules and other more exotic things such as skyships and Red Steel. I've heard from Mystara fans that it's a bit of a hodge podge world.

So my theory is that if we advance the timeline, advance the technology level some, and provide some unifying events, the world could evolve into more of a cohesive whole. Making it "swashbuckling skyship adventures" gives you a theme that then sets it apart from the Realms.

 

[the Jester]

So my theory is that if we advance the timeline, advance the technology level some, and provide some unifying events, the world could evolve into more of a cohesive whole. Making it "swashbuckling skyship adventures" gives you a theme that then sets it apart from the Realms.

I suspect that this would lose many of the old fans. That's the problem- it's hard to imagine a way Mystara 4e could both capture the old fans and bring in new ones with a "shiny new different" approach.

 

[ExploderWizard]

I suspect that this would lose many of the old fans. That's the problem- it's hard to imagine a way Mystara 4e could both capture the old fans and bring in new ones with a "shiny new different" approach.

Yup. Mystara is just fine as it is to use with any edition.

 

[Markn]

I suspect that this would lose many of the old fans. That's the problem- it's hard to imagine a way Mystara 4e could both capture the old fans and bring in new ones with a "shiny new different" approach.

Bingo! The problem with Mystara, is that you can enhance any particular aspect of the world to give it a unique feel - which unforunately - at the same time destroys the Mystara feel.

I just don't think there is a way to keep it Mystara and keep the old fans while making it unique enough to produce again. In many ways, it is similar to FR in that certain areas of the world deal with different themes.

****

If I were to update Mystara, I would do a few things:

1 - Reboot the world in the same vein as Dark Sun was
2 - Focus on the culture of the duchies/countries/provinces
3 - Focus on expansionism which was a strong theme in the original setting. This would include rules for running kingdoms, establishing kingdoms, exploration and so forth. Just as the new annnounced Ravenloft game is both stand alone and another D&D world, which allows players to play vampires and ghosts, Mystara could add rules for the kingdom stuff, including mass combat. Paizo has shown there is huge demand for this area. This area would definately showcase the airships!
4 - The main campaign setting would flesh out the successful bits from the past. Then rather than print a creature catalog I would make a kingdom builder book.

I'm sure I would do more but this is what springs to mind - and, I think - it would stand the best chance of being produced under the 4e guidelines.
it and rerelease it, I think I would focus on expansionism as the main theme. Karameikos was a colony of Thyatis, and there were always strong themes of competition between Alphatia and Thyatis. There were constantly wars between the different regions. You could easily enhance the airship aspects of the world.

 

[Dragonhelm]

Bingo! The problem with Mystara, is that you can enhance any particular aspect of the world to give it a unique feel - which unforunately - at the same time destroys the Mystara feel.

What is the "Mystara feel"? As I look at Mystara, I see little difference between it and many other pseudo-earth settings.

It is those things that are different in Mystara that strike my fancy. Skyships, immortals, Red Steel. That's all good stuff.

1 - Reboot the world in the same vein as Dark Sun was

That's not a bad idea, so long as the setting becomes a cohesive whole.

3 - Focus on expansionism which was a strong theme in the original setting. This would include rules for running kingdoms, establishing kingdoms, exploration and so forth. Just as the new annnounced Ravenloft game is both stand alone and another D&D world, which allows players to play vampires and ghosts, Mystara could add rules for the kingdom stuff, including mass combat. Paizo has shown there is huge demand for this area. This area would definately showcase the airships!

My only concern is that this might tread into Birthright's territory some.


Should the Forgotten Realms "kill Mystara and take its stuff"? I'm not talking about porting in landmasses or anything, but rather taking ideas from Mystara and importing them.

In Dragonlance, several ideas from Taladas were ported over to Ansalon, which made Ansalon a richer place. I'm just wondering if the same could be said here.

 

[Markn]

What is the "Mystara feel"? As I look at Mystara, I see little difference between it and many other pseudo-earth settings.

It is those things that are different in Mystara that strike my fancy. Skyships, immortals, Red Steel. That's all good stuff.

I'm just not sure that Skyships, Immortals and Red Steel is enough to differentiate it and give it a strong enough hook on its owm.

In regards to FR, I think FR has enough that it doesn't have to take from Mystara, nor would it ingratiate the fans of Mystara either.

As for Birthright, it does tread on that world a bit, but there were other themes to Birthright (bloodlines, forex) that still seperate it. Plus I never saw Birthright as that successful. On the flipside, the most popular products of the Mystara world dealt with exploration, expansionism, mass combat (sometimes only as a background element, sometimes as a foreground element). As the game got into higher levels, the machinations of the countries was huge - there were wars, there were modules for the players to establish duchies (Norwold) and even in the beginning Karameikos was trying to gain independance from the "motherland". All this flavor could be maintained while tying together the things you like (airships, Immortals and Red Steel) and making them more prevalent throughout the setting. Heck, it really feels like Epic Destiny's would work so well for the original concept of becomming an Immortal.

I wonder if the current PoL setting drew some of its mechanics Mystara.

PS - On a different not, I know how involved you have been in Dragonlance and I was once a big fan. I feel the world has gone to hell in a handbasket due to the novel line and sincerely hope there is a reboot there as well. Sorry people for going off topic.

 

[S'mon]

I don't know why Mystara works so well, only that it's the most fun I've had in a published setting - for me it worked better than Greyhawk, and vastly better than Forgotten Realms. This goes for both the surface and for the Hollow World. I'd hazard a guess that one reason is that it feels like fundamentally an optimistic setting; it's vigorous and vital. Human civilisation is expanding. People are exploring; things are getting better.

 

[ProfessorCirno]

I don't know why Mystara works so well, only that it's the most fun I've had in a published setting - for me it worked better than Greyhawk, and vastly better than Forgotten Realms. This goes for both the surface and for the Hollow World. I'd hazard a guess that one reason is that it feels like fundamentally an optimistic setting; it's vigorous and vital. Human civilisation is expanding. People are exploring; things are getting better.

This, right here, is what you concentrate on.

Think of it in terms of "ages."

Forgotten Realms is just PoL land with different names. An age of darkness, lots of loss, things are just rolling downhill.

Eberron is between WWI and WWII. Two fisted pulp action, political intrigue - an age of chance.

Dark Sun is an age of ruin. Everything is terrible, you're on Deathplanet, what few civilizations remain are ruled by tyrannical despots.

So what would Mystara concentrate on? Being an age of discovery. I admittingly know little about Mystara as a setting, but concentrating on swashbuckling, expanding civilization, a very 1600's-1700's feel could help set it apart. Instead of the points of light idea of 4e geography, change the idea of geography to that of an empty map. A previous age ended long ago, and civilization has finished picking itself up off the ground. It's not a world of darkness with points of light, it's a vast and sprawling "Unknown territories" that's just begging to be found, explored, and perhaps even looted. It's time to go into the unknown and uncharted lands. Heroic campaign, you belong to a country, perhaps a quazi-legal guild of adventurers. Paragon campaign, you've obtained your own land, building your own colony, gaining independence. And then epic campaign would be all about the Immortals and, well, becoming one.

Would this scare away previous Mystara fans? Hell, I dunno. I made up half of that. Would it give the setting something that stands out? I think so. I am admittingly, to some degree, just utilizing my own homebrew setting for ideas here