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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Neonchameleon" data-source="post: 6075799" data-attributes="member: 87792">If you are not going to engage withmy actual arguments, I don't see too much purpose in continuing.  My comment about people who learned to play under 3.X was about those who learned to play from 3.X, not those who learned to play from an experienced DM.  It's about all the school groups that taught themselves to play based on the rulebooks rather than anyone you have taught.  This isn't the first time that D&D has had such an issue - it is fairly well known that groups who learned to play from Gygax or from someone who learned from Gygax in the oD&D/1e days end up with a sneaky, stealthy, paranoid playstyle about looting the dungeon and not engaging except at overwhelming advantage.  Groups who learned to play from the books ended up with a much more directly combatative approach and were behind the XP for GP rule being extremely controversial to the point of being removed because nowhere in the books does it say why this rule is there.  In almost all games there is an expectation that everyone will play fair, whatever that means, and what fair means can be gleaned from the books - but play is a far better teacher and people learn more from doing than from books.As for "video game thinking", I couldn't disagree more.  MMOs are full of pointles grind and video games in general are full of arbitrary rules.  Like arbitrarily taking away powers.  Video game thinking is "My way or the highway".  The difference between a video game and an RPG is that video games are a waterfall model of development and playtested by many - RPGs what the DM brings to the table is only part of the story.The cuts and bruises on the boxer's face are still there.  Of course they are.  That is why the boxer is quite a few healing surges below his maximum.  Healing surges spent is a measure of damage taken just as hit points are.  (Just one reason "healing surges" is a terrible name for the concept).  As for the hero getting treated by the paramedics, not often.  Where in "Raiders of the Lost Ark" are there paramedics?  Or in Conan?  If you mean the hero gets bandaged up before continuing, sure.  What do you think happens in a short rest?  A breather and bandages for them as needs them.  Which is generally the people reduced below 0hp rather than those just bruised.  And then they continue on if they want to - like action movie heroes (seriously, does bandaging his feet up stop John McClane in the only Die Hard movie worth talking about?  Although he's pretty much out of surges by then).</blockquote>

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