Reply to thread

Message

<blockquote data-quote="N'raac" data-source="post: 6077973" data-attributes="member: 6681948">I think this comes from the source material concept of a warrior-priest, a crusader (frankly, not a few icons that were later subsumed by Paladins), etc.&nbsp; Pathfinder dropped the Cleric down to Medium armor and retained (non-tower) shields.&nbsp; However, as a large shield precludes using that hand for anything else, most clerics stick to small shields to have that hand free for somatic gestures.&nbsp; Otherwise, drop the weapon if you want to cast.I think what has happened over the years is that clerics have gained more versatile, and more combat-oriented, spells.&nbsp; That might mandate a reduction of their martial abilities.&nbsp; Meanwhile, the old &quot;blunt weapons only&quot; moved to more religion-specific exceptions (good) that generally added a much better melee weapon (more martial ability, rather than less).Perhaps a greater focus on religion would be appropriate.&nbsp; Maybe some clerics that get martial weapons and heavy armor proficiencies (maybe even full BAB advancement), but get reduced spellcasting, curtailed channeling of divine energy, maybe only one domain and/or drop down on will saves - more martial advantages means less casting advantages.&nbsp; Meanwhile, some clerics might get only very low power weapon choices, light or no armor, no shields, 1/2 BAB progression, but are better spellcasters, perhaps get a third domain, better options w.r.t. channeling divine energy,other options enhancing casting at the expense of martial ability.&nbsp; In the middle might be the &quot;standard cleric&quot; with medium armor, perhaps shields, 2 domains, etc. - tweaked only a little from the current cleric (if the spellcaster cleric is to have more spell power, I think it should cap at the current baseline cleric, so maybe the default gets pulled back a bit, either in spells per day or spell list).But I don't want to go back to the days when the players drew straws for who got stuck playing the cleric, so the class has to be interesting and viable.&nbsp; 3e changes went a long way to making the cleric interesting to play, rather than the guy who patches up the REAL heroes after the battle and acts as a medic during combat.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="N'raac, post: 6077973, member: 6681948"] I think this comes from the source material concept of a warrior-priest, a crusader (frankly, not a few icons that were later subsumed by Paladins), etc. Pathfinder dropped the Cleric down to Medium armor and retained (non-tower) shields. However, as a large shield precludes using that hand for anything else, most clerics stick to small shields to have that hand free for somatic gestures. Otherwise, drop the weapon if you want to cast. I think what has happened over the years is that clerics have gained more versatile, and more combat-oriented, spells. That might mandate a reduction of their martial abilities. Meanwhile, the old "blunt weapons only" moved to more religion-specific exceptions (good) that generally added a much better melee weapon (more martial ability, rather than less). Perhaps a greater focus on religion would be appropriate. Maybe some clerics that get martial weapons and heavy armor proficiencies (maybe even full BAB advancement), but get reduced spellcasting, curtailed channeling of divine energy, maybe only one domain and/or drop down on will saves - more martial advantages means less casting advantages. Meanwhile, some clerics might get only very low power weapon choices, light or no armor, no shields, 1/2 BAB progression, but are better spellcasters, perhaps get a third domain, better options w.r.t. channeling divine energy,other options enhancing casting at the expense of martial ability. In the middle might be the "standard cleric" with medium armor, perhaps shields, 2 domains, etc. - tweaked only a little from the current cleric (if the spellcaster cleric is to have more spell power, I think it should cap at the current baseline cleric, so maybe the default gets pulled back a bit, either in spells per day or spell list). But I don't want to go back to the days when the players drew straws for who got stuck playing the cleric, so the class has to be interesting and viable. 3e changes went a long way to making the cleric interesting to play, rather than the guy who patches up the REAL heroes after the battle and acts as a medic during combat. [/QUOTE]

Verification