When Bob wants to play a female PC

[der_kluge]

Dude, you are completely out of line here.

Well, that's one position. I disagree. He stated he was uncomfortable allowing cross-gender playing in RL, but was comfortable with allowing it online. The only difference is that he doesn't have to actually see the player playing a gender they weren't. The only word I have in my vocabulary to describe that is homophobe. He may very well not be. But there has to be a more appropriate word to describe that.

Because he's comfortable allowing it online, that means that he belives that men are perfectly capable of playing female characters. So, we've removed pretty much every possible reason why it would bother him, except for the visible one. What word would you use?

 

[Wulf Ratbane]

And if you would allow cross-gender playing in an online thread, away from having to see a 200 pound bearded guy play an elf maiden, then you'd be perfectly comfortable with it.

It is a combination of suspension of disbelief coupled with intrinsic vs. extrinsic characteristics.

The intrinsic characteristics we subconsciously predefine based on what we are seeing. We don't do this with extrinsic characteristics (in real life or in play) because we just don't know. And so we subconsicously categorize the intrinsic values into things we already know and feel safe making assumptions about, and we categorize the extrinsic values into things we don't know and have to remember about each player's character.

So, yes, an irreligious person can play a cleric. That's an extrinsic characteristic that we don't make any assumptions about.

It is far more difficult for a male player to play a female character. It's jarring, because that's an intrinsic characteristic that we think we've already categorized. You're required to constantly remind yourself, "Oh yeah. He's not male, he's female."

And it's friggin annoying.

Put the man on the other side of a computer screen, and you remove that obstacle.


Wulf

 

[Wulf Ratbane]

Because he's comfortable allowing it online, that means that he belives that men are perfectly capable of playing female characters. So, we've removed pretty much every possible reason why it would bother him, except for the visible one. What word would you use?

See post above, Dr. Freud.

 

[der_kluge]

Yes. I have told someone who was a blatant atheist that he could not play a cleric. He spent the previous year bashing religion at the game table. Funny enough, no one bashed it before a religious person joined the group, yet two people decided to constantly make off-color jokes about religion after the new person joined the group.

Why would I let them play a cleric?

Well, it's unfortunate that Grandma's rules won't allow such a discussion, but that would certainly make an interesting seque thread. I'm atheist, and I love playing clerics. Probably my most favorite class.

Interesting.

 

[der_kluge]

1.) Did I take a poll? Yes I did. I always have an after campaign wrap-up where I asked people what they thought went well with the game and what were the major problems with the campaign. Everyone mentioned the cross-gender PC, including the person who played that character.

Good for you. But it sounds like people had more of an issue with the player, and not necessarily the fact that he played a female character. I mean, it sounds like they would have taken an issue with this person no matter what he chose to play.

 

[Lasher Dragon]

So, you presume to have the imagination to concoct entire realms of fantasy, replete with creatures only imagined in some darkest corner of the psyche, and have a hard time imagining that one of your buddies is playing <gasp> a woman? Is that what you are saying?

 

[Wulf Ratbane]

So, you presume to have the imagination to concoct entire realms of fantasy, replete with creatures only imagined in some darkest corner of the psyche, and have a hard time imagining that one of your buddies is playing <gasp> a woman? Is that what you are saying?

That's exactly what I am saying. Congrats on your reading comprehension.

 

[der_kluge]

When I started this whole thread I thought I was somewhat open-minded. I felt a bit guilty about asking one of my players to change his back-up character from female to male. I came to the boards to see if, indeed, that was wrong of me. I truly believe I could have been convinced that my request was heavy-handed, and I'd have changed my position. As was mentioned, I've had gamers play female characters in the past (though, to be honest, I'd have preferred they hadn't).

So, in between that time and now, some things have changed. The hyperbole and bitterness displayed here has, ironically, made me more comfortable with the decision I first made. I think human nature tends to have us associate arguments with the manner they are presented; I've found it difficult to fairly digest some posts because the poster was unable or unwilling to present his/her thoughts in a diplomatic fashion. Maybe that's my loss.

Just for the record, you came here seeking opinions, and you yourself asked if you were weird or not.

And to quote that one line of my post isn't quite fair. I myself stated that I didn't think it was the proper word to use, but the only one I could come up with. I still know of no better word to describe it.

You yourself stated that you would allow cross-gender role-playing in an online scenario. But you didn't like it where you could actually see the guy playing a female character.

Why is it? You tell me. You know you better than I do. I can only speculate.

 

[Wulf Ratbane]

Why is it? You tell me. You know you better than I do. I can only speculate.

And not very well at that.

It's simple. Human nature is to rely on our eyes, to believe what we see.

There are enough details in the game to have to keep track of. To have to constantly REWRITE what your eyes are telling you is annoying.

Can it be done? Of course. But it's obviously EASIER for Bob to play a woman when we're not sitting across the table from him, fat, bearded, and male as he is.

 

[Lasher Dragon]

I keep picturing Francis from Stripes for some reason...