When is a campaign setting no longer relevant?

[Storminator]

Settings can't go out 'out of date'. They can, however, accrue a large body of uninteresting ...

I would say that when previously interesting material is no longer interesting (the older set has played it out, and the younger set doesn't care...) then the setting is out of date.

I think it's difficult for a popular setting to go out of date, because it was likely popular because it's material had some strong universal appeal. I think a quirky, interesting, marginal setting could go out of date. Spelljammer? Planescape? Maybe some parts of Eberron will go flat (if you tire of pulp and noir (ahem: HERETIC!) what else would you play there?) if left untended.

PS

 

[Doug McCrae]

Yeah, settings can go out of date, attitudes change. What was fine in the 30s or 70s can look racist or sexist to us now. Fears of global warming, terrorism and the economic downturn have replaced the terror of a global nuclear exchange during the Cold War. The interest in Forteana, aliens and the weird of the X-Files era has given way to grittier more morally questionable fare such as 24.

In fantasy settings, the treatment of black people in REH's Conan looks appallingly racist to us now, whereas it was unremarkable in the 30s. The 100% evil bad guys from Lord of the Rings seem better fitted to the World War 2 period than to today's world. Peter Jackson's LotR gives women a stronger role than Tolkien's. Present day retellings of the Robin Hood story make Maid Marion a lot more 'kickass' than she was originally. Out of 61 nations in the original Greyhawk boxed set, two have female rulers. Compare that to Eberron. The nuclear war parable of the Rain of Colorless Fire seems dated now, Dark Sun's ecological disaster feels a lot more relevant to contemporary concerns. The sexism and unexamined racism of the drow are a 70s timewarp.

 

[rounser]

Yeah, settings can go out of date, attitudes change.

Apart from that bit about the X Files, you seem to be saying that only the political correctness needs an update. Surely that's easy to fix. We could make the Circle of Eight more diverse and representative than just old white guys, for instance, and call it a day. (Yes, being facetious here.)

Only I suspect that there's much more to it than that. Greyhawk is late 70s, and the political movements and changes in societal attitude you're referring to were already underway for the most part. I think that although they are relevant, they're only a piece of the puzzle.

 

[Mallus]

I would say that when previously interesting material is no longer interesting (the older set has played it out, and the younger set doesn't care...) then the setting is out of date.

While this might just be semantics, I think it's valuable to draw a distinction between between played out and dated. The former suggests that the target audience has used the material and become bored with it; it is no longer fresh and exciting. The latter suggests the material no longer holds a strong appeal for a contemporary audience; it is no longer relevant, or, more likely, it contains stated/unstated assumptions/value judgments that are now deemed offensive.

 

[Mallus]

Out of 61 nations in the original Greyhawk boxed set, two have female rulers. Compare that to Eberron. The nuclear war parable of the Rain of Colorless Fire seems dated now, Dark Sun's ecological disaster feels a lot more relevant to contemporary concerns. The sexism and unexamined racism of the drow are a 70s timewarp.

You know, I agree with everything you wrote... except that I don't think those dated elements matter much because I don't see them as crucial to the appeal of those settings (not even the core eco-disaster allegory in Dark Sun).

 

[DrunkonDuty]

Well I'd say any literary piece can go out of date/become dated. As mentioned by others things like attitudes towards gender and race have changed over the last 30 years. So game settings, as published, yes they can they can and do go out of date.

The beauty of gaming is that we the players get to put our own spin on any gaming mileu we use. Any group can conjure any themes it wishes in a setting. A setting will only go out of date if it is let to. I guess I think a game setting is a living artefact that continues to grow and evolve as long as people use it.

 

[Krensky]

A campaign setting (as distinct from it's source material) only becomes irrelevant when someone can't find people to play in it. It may go out of fashion or be declared dated by soulless hipsters, but if a world sings to you and you can find others to play, it's not irrelevant.

 

[Storminator]

While this might just be semantics, I think it's valuable to draw a distinction between between played out and dated. The former suggests that the target audience has used the material and become bored with it; it is no longer fresh and exciting. The latter suggests the material no longer holds a strong appeal for a contemporary audience; it is no longer relevant, or, more likely, it contains stated/unstated assumptions/value judgments that are now deemed offensive.

I'd agree.

I was postulating a setting that was both played out and dated. That's how it became irrelevant. It took both conditions. The original target audience has become bored, and the material doesn't appeal to any new targets.

I can't think of any settings that meet those criteria.

PS

 

[an_idol_mind]

I think the problem exists more for futuristic settings than traditional fantasy ones. Cyberpunk 2020 is very dated, for example. On the other hand, the weird tech of Blackmoor or the social structure of Forgotten Realms drow don't need to keep up with modern standards because the setting itself is supposed to resemble a time gone by.

 

[Ariosto]

The original Traveller RPG had memory values for huge megacomputers which modern USB sticks easily surpass by multiple orders of magnitude.

I don't see any such values (or even "huge megacomputers") therein. The CPU factors are abstract, and the programs are imponderabilia. (They also add interesting choices to the tactical space combat game.)

If memory serves, there are quantifications in real-world terms of those and other matters in MegaTraveller and Traveller: The New Era. One might misinterpret some game design assumptions, but one ought at least to have some that can be interpreted objectively before one makes such factual claims.

(The "Murphy's Rules" cartoon put comedy before accuracy, not letting full context get in the way of a good gag -- any more than strict realism gets in the way of a good SF story or game.)

This looks to me like another case in which an attempt to be "up to date" introduced opportunity to become "dated".