White water rafting at 11th level

[RangerWickett]

I want an encounter where the PCs chase a dragon down the Colorado River, or the fantasy equivalent. Basically, big canyon, fast river, nasty monster. The party will be 11th level, and I'm thinking the critter will be an adult black dragon (level 11 solo lurker), but with no wings. The hazards of the river should make for a nice climax encounter, and keep the solo fight from getting boring.

But, how should I do the river?

I figure normally they can just stay in the boat with no problems. When they hit rough water, it takes easy Acrobatic checks (which is, what, DC 12 at 11th level?) each round to stay in their boat. If they fall out or get pushed out by the dragon's tail lash, it's an easy, medium or potentially hard Athletics check (depending on how rough the water is) to stay above the surface.

Then people will have to help those who fell overboard get back to the boat, or be left imperiled as the dragon swims around them, attacking them.

I'm thinking in some places, the water should be shallow enough to deal damage if they fail a swim check and get dashed against the rocks. Say, d8+5 damage per round you fail a swim check while in the rapids. Key rules for aquatic combat are on page 45 in the DMG.

I might pace the encounter so that the water starts fairly gentle, gets rough every few rounds, and then goes into rapids when the dragon gets down to 3/4 hp. When he gets bloodied, the water gets back to normal, and then when he's down to 1/4 hp, the fight goes over a waterfall. The dragon keeps his lair behind the waterfall.

I'll need to think of cool stuff to do inside the lair, but I think I want some place big, to let the PCs actually walk for a change. To balance that, the dragon ought to have some help, like traps or minions.

How does that sound? Any suggestions?

 

[Klaus]

Sounds a couple of kinds of awesome, RW.

Treat the rapids as a Skill Challenge within the combat.

Key Skills:
Nature (Moderate) - anticipate what's ahead. Success gives +2 to next Acrobatics check.
Acrobatics (Easy) - to stay on boat. Failure = fall overboard.
Athletics (Hard) - overboard characters only. Success = get back in the boat.
Endurance (Moderate) - Withstand the speed and bumps. Tough it out.
Arcana (Hard) - anticipate where the dragon will pop up next. Success gives +2 to defenses for 1 round.
Perception (Hard) - to spot oncoming dangers or underwater dragon.

 

[RangerWickett]

Well, after reading Obsidian's new skill challenge system, I'm not a huge fan of skill challenges as written. Rather, I think I'll let the PCs use skills whenever they ask, and then afterward reward XP based on how often they succeeded on challenging tasks.

But yeah, I'll definitely involve skill checks to make things easier or harder throughout the combat. Maybe anyone can spend a minor action to get better footing, look out for trouble ahead, or spot the dragon while he's underwater.

I might give him weak wings, so he can just jump out and glide over the rapids, thus avoiding damage unless the PCs screw with him.

The way I'm envisioning setting up the encounter is that the dragon has been abducting people, and lore tells of a draconic holy day coming up. The dragon is collecting food for a feast, but no one knows where his lair is. They do, however, know where the temple he worships in is, so the PCs can track him down there. But that temple just happens to be on the edge of a 30-ft. cliff overlooking the river.

The PCs can take rafts downstream to the temple (overland would take too long in the hazardous terrain), so they'll have water transportation easily available when the dragon flees.

 

[Quickleaf]

Sounds like an awesome fun adventure!

I would be terrified as a PC in that situation, especially anyone wearing metal armor. That said, the drowning rules in 4e are fubared. You can hold your breath for a ridiculous amount of time (but strangely it gets harder the higher you level) Also, the underwater combat rules allow PCs to do some things that push the limits of believability, like free dive to 400 feet without taking damage. Just some thoughts on the rules.

With the lair, I like the idea of a slick, misty, loud place. X squares within the waterfall are deafening & dense fog. Make communication difficult within X+5 squares and treat all ground as difficult terrain which can be ignored on an Acrobatics check (knocked prone if you fail).

I used to be a whitewater guide in another life, so a few ideas based on real-life rafting...
[sblock=whitewater]
Is the river at high or low water (hazards should reflect this, with waves at high water and boney sections at low water)?

Is this a short action sequence or a chase over the course of days? If days, where are the PCs' supplies, in a gear boat?

Is there a portage required at any point and how does the dragon deal with it? Is the PC's raft an oar or a paddle rig? If an oar rig who is at the helm?

What if the raft flips and everyone swims? How do you model a character climbing on the raft's back side and flipping it right side up?

What if the raft is wrapped on a rock and sinking, can the characters set up a z-drag or some other rope/pulley system to loose the raft in time?

Does the river make a U-bend at any point where a character could conceivably run overland and head the dragon off?

What happens if the PC guide is pitched forward from the raft going over the falls (a common occurence)? Can the other PCs drag them back in?

Are there "strainers" in the river (fallen trees, old structures, dead cows) that could pose a hazard especially to swimmers?[/sblock]

 

[AbdulAlhazred]

It is an awesome idea. I think overall your skill check ideas sound like they will work pretty well too! I love adventures that reward higher skill characters as much as they reward the ones decked with every combat bonus feat there is.

The drowning rules are much better after the errata, so the weirdness with breath holding is no longer an issue AFAICT.

You might want to look through the AV rules for vehicles WRT how the steersman guides the raft and what happens when/if he's unable to do so.

Characters might be allowed one or two non-standard sorts of action, like use their standard action to 'hunker down' and get a bonus to stay in the raft when they see it is about to hit a bad spot. Pretty much a 'full defense' option applied to hanging on.

There COULD be a skill challenge element applied in terms of overall endurance. Having done a few rafting trips I can say that exhaustion is a real factor there, so possibly passing a challenge like that could allow the PCs to avoid say an HS toll that reflects them tiring out. Kind of depends on the length of the sequence really I suppose.

The waterfall could drop everyone into a big pool of water at the bottom. Thus damage from the fall could be negligible or non-existent (maybe another skill check to avoid some damage when you hit, good place to use Acrobatics).

The dragon cave could also have an underwater exit to the pool and various water pools inside it that the dragon can use to move around once it gets there. Minions could be something like aquatic creatures (crayfish, frogs, turtles, big fish, etc).

Let us know how it goes. As it happens there is a canyon in my campaign too in an area the PCs are now getting ready to explore and I wouldn't mind being able to shamelessly steal some tested ideas!

 

[Daern]

I too am a raft guide and have often thought of this. Your ideas sound great! Probably best not to get too detailed, but what might be safe to assume is that one way or another everyone is gonna swim, in which case you might want to have them "wash into" the dragon's lair. Shipwrecked so to speak.
btw, what about individual kayaks provided by local halfling daredevils?

 

[Primitive Screwhead]

RW,

That sounds like a great encounter.. and I am not too happy about RAW skill challenges either. I love the obsidion system, but do not think this would be a good fit for this encounter.

The way I would do it is to have the main raft racing down the river while the Dragon loops around it trying to snatch the PCs off and/or kill them outright.

The river is an active opponent that affects the PCs based on 4 'bands' of difficulty. Each band has its own attack check and damage expression.
When in the water, the PC has to spend 1 move action swimming to stay afloat and can spend a second move action to swim to a new band in the river {requires skill check}

PCs on the raft can use a skill check to direct the raft into the less violent portions (band) of the river, ala the AV rules.
Each round the river makes a ranged area attack against the raft vs Ref, a hit causes prone and push 3, possibly shoving a PC off the raft and up to a band away. 'Hanging on' is a move action that grants a +1 bonus to REF per hand used, and you can spend a standard action as well, netting a total +4 bonus vs Reflex. +6 if you stay prone. But of course this means you are not dealing with the Dragon....
The river also makes an attack vs Fort against any creatures in the water, dealing damage and earning a secondary attack against that creature vs Will that dazes for one round.

This gives the players choices about how to deal with the river, and potential conflict when a PC is in a higher band but stunned... do they risk the entire raft in more dangerous waters to save thier buddy?

The end piece works well as a cut-scene when the raft goes over the waterfall and crashes into the rocks, washing the heroes up into shallow water while the Dragon retreats under the waterfall. Again the choice is in the players hand of pursuing it into its lair or trying to rest up in hopes that the Dragon doesn't benefit more from the respite. The wounded dragon would play kitty-bar the door back through any laid traps/hazards to its main lair where it would have to make a final stand.

Using the river and traps/hazards allows you to stick to only a single 'monster' without having to bring other critters inside the Dragons home.
You could have 6 or more 'bands' of river strength, with only 4 avalable in any given segment of the river. That keeps the swimming characters within a band or two of the raft and forces the PCs to deal with the rougher water.


I too look forward to hearing what you end up going with and how it works

 

[WampusCat43]

This has limited use to you, but I did something similar to this in my 3.5 game a few years ago. The PCs booked passage down a large river on a big, fairly flat barge. The crew was obviously experienced at whitewater, but what they didn't know was that three large spiders had set up camp above the first set of rapids.

Failing difficult Spot checks, their first inkling of danger was when the guy guiding the boat (the only person standing upright) went "Whuff" as he hit a large single strand of webbing across the river. He was snatched up in the air, and the group watched in horror one of the spiders closed in and killed him.

Right about then they realized two more things - no one was controlling the boat any longer, and two additional spiders just landed on it, tipping the raft and causing all the cargo to start sliding downhill.

What followed was a careening free-for-all as the players had to decide to either fight the spiders, control the boat, help the captain get to the rear of the boat, defend the passengers, or just hang on and not risk begin thrown off.

I think you definitely have to consider what happens if the dragon grabs the boat and tries to flip it. All I know is, to this day my PCs won't go near the water. They sound like a variation on Chef's line in Apocalypse Now: "Don't get into the boat...Don't get into the boat..."

 

[Daern]

The river is an active opponent that affects the PCs based on 4 'bands' of difficulty. Each band has its own attack check and damage expression.

This whole idea sounds rad.

 

[RangerWickett]

I'm probably going to run this Tuesday. I'm working on the rules tonight. I'll post once I have them ready.