Whither the gnome?

[Dice4Hire]

In every edition, it's always interesting how people who don't play gnomes seem so eager to crap on the race for those who do. Even elves, which Gygax knows, 2E tried to salt the earth on, don't get treated this way by their non-fans. See: Every discussion of gnomes in the pre-4E threads.

I am perfectly willing to go on against elves, but this thread is for gnomes

 

[Olgar Shiverstone]

Subraces people!

May rock gnomes the AD&D illusion-loving miners, and make forest gnomes the wild-hair "Ima monster" style oddities...

And svirfneblin?

 

[Remathilis]

And svirfneblin?

Drow, Svirfneblin, and Duergar should be their own races.

 

[Olgar Shiverstone]

Drow, Svirfneblin, and Duergar should be their own races.

Why not sub-races?

 

[TrippyHippy]

On the subject of Half-Elves, would anybody object to have them listed as an sub-culture of Elves? That is, listed alongside High Elves and Wood Elves?

I see the legitimacy of Half Elves in a Tolkien sense, but would prefer to execution to be done differently.

 

[Remathilis]

Why not sub-races?

Too many funky powers. I want Drow with spell-like abilities, duergar with psionics and natural invisibility, and svirfneblin with earth-elemental summoning. That don't seem in line with a +1 to X score and a minor ability.

 

[TrippyHippy]

On the subject of Gnomes, I think the major problem for me personally is that I've never seen one played by anybody except for running it as a 'humorous' character. Y'now the types "Yay, I'm a hyperactive Gnome pyromaniac - sqeeeek!!!"

Humourous for the person playing it maybe, an irritation for everybody else.

To some extent, I am sympathetic for people having options but beyond the comedy routine, what are Gnomes good for? If it came down to it, I'd rather include another character race instead. What about Centaurs?

 

[Olgar Shiverstone]

Too many funky powers. I want Drow with spell-like abilities, duergar with psionics and natural invisibility, and svirfneblin with earth-elemental summoning. That don't seem in line with a +1 to X score and a minor ability.

Not as playable races, no ... but those could be the "monster" versions.

 

[Remathilis]

Not as playable races, no ... but those could be the "monster" versions.

Guess that REALLY depends on how they're handling "monsters as PCs" then...

 

[ferratus]

Too many funky powers. I want Drow with spell-like abilities, duergar with psionics and natural invisibility, and svirfneblin with earth-elemental summoning. That don't seem in line with a +1 to X score and a minor ability.

I don't particularly see that as a problem.

High Elves get a free cantrip, so I don't see why the drow's cantrip can't be darkness or faerie fire, picking up both with a feat. Drow aristocrats had levitation, but that seemed to be from their house insignia.

Duegar's invisibility and giant size are too powerful to be a racial power, but it could be picked up with a race specific speciality, and psionics will show up as a class eventually.

Svirfneblin (I really want to call them rock gnomes) have the same sort of illusion spells as other gnomes, along with the ability to summon an elemental if you have enough Hit Dice.

None of these things really scream "I need my own race" as the abilities are either trivial enough to be a racial variant, or are so powerful you couldn't get a racial ability for it anyway so it has to be a power you pick up later in the game somehow.