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Message: <blockquote data-quote="mneme" data-source="post: 5084242" data-attributes="member: 59248">The "why are there no fast heroes" thread was clearly off, but it did raise an interesting question.  As of PH3, every current and announced leader class will have a Wisdom build (a build with either wisdom as primary or secondary -- Cleric and shaman have it as primary, plus the bow-based bard, two out of three Artificer builds, the Enlightened Ardent, and (with PH3) the bow-using Warlord).  Charisma is primary in two leader classes (Ardent & Bard) and secondary for others.  Strength is primary for Warlord and Cleric, Int is sprimary for some Warlords, secondary for most, and primary for all Artificers.  Con is secondary for four types of leaders -- shamans, bards, artificers, and ardents.  But what about leaders with Dex?There are no leaders with Dex as a primary stat.There are no leaders with Dex as a secondary stat.And, while we're at it, there are no leaders with Stealth as a class skill.Sure, yes, most types of leaders lead from the front, or call out their orders in a loud voice, or whatever. But when you've got a question like, say "who should lead this strike team of special forces guys", you end up with an off-stat multiclass (eg, an 18/18 multi with with weak special effects, like a cleric multiclassing into rogue) or a striker multiclassed to a leader, wheras there's no reason you -couldn't- have such a leader (in fact, there have been several leaders that could have gone this way and didn't--Presicent bard could have been dex rather than YA Wis/Cha leader; and the skirmishing warlord has no reason she can't use Dex as the new Warlord secondary rather than yet -another- leader using Wis as primary or secondary).But "speed" isn't the issue here; It's sneakiness (and to an extent the other Dex skills, Thievery and Acrobatics. But the party isn't rewarded for everyone having those skills like they can be for all having Stealth, and at least Thievery and Acrobatics appear on the skill list for some leaders (well, one each; Bard and Artificer)).I'll note that Dex certainly is singled out here -- every non-dex skill appears on at least two different Leader skill lists, too.Can't the sneaky guys get some decent leadership, rather than having all the ranged leaders shoot with Wisdom?  And can't -some- leadership happen from the shadows?</blockquote>

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