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<blockquote data-quote="AbdulAlhazred" data-source="post: 6650626" data-attributes="member: 82106">level 1 seems to be both an anti-cherrypicking measure and to some extent a gimme to those who want either a 'meatgrinder level' or an 'apprentice level'. Though IMHO 5e's level 1 PCs are rather tougher and more capable than either of those use cases would prefer. They're definitely 'beyond normal', the wizard can throw Fire Bolt all day, the Fighter has something like 2x the hit points of a normal human, etc. So they aren't apprentices exactly, at least not quite to the degree that other games have had 'level 0' PCs. Nor are they the monster-equivalent skulking would-be tomb raiders of 0e or B/X days, they have substantial staying power, resources, and options. I think they were divided on how level 1 should work, and the result is sort of neither fish nor fowl. Its not too bad from my perspective, you get to level 3 in 2 sessions and move on, without drastic mortality. So yeah, I think level 3 is about equivalent to 4e level 1, and from there 5e's next 17 levels roughly approximate the next 10 or so levels of 4e, except wizards get a huge break, they benefit from all the rapid hit point increases, but they also get high level spells plus the 5e version of ritual casting, pretty sweet if you're a wizard!</blockquote>

[QUOTE="AbdulAlhazred, post: 6650626, member: 82106"] level 1 seems to be both an anti-cherrypicking measure and to some extent a gimme to those who want either a 'meatgrinder level' or an 'apprentice level'. Though IMHO 5e's level 1 PCs are rather tougher and more capable than either of those use cases would prefer. They're definitely 'beyond normal', the wizard can throw Fire Bolt all day, the Fighter has something like 2x the hit points of a normal human, etc. So they aren't apprentices exactly, at least not quite to the degree that other games have had 'level 0' PCs. Nor are they the monster-equivalent skulking would-be tomb raiders of 0e or B/X days, they have substantial staying power, resources, and options. I think they were divided on how level 1 should work, and the result is sort of neither fish nor fowl. Its not too bad from my perspective, you get to level 3 in 2 sessions and move on, without drastic mortality. So yeah, I think level 3 is about equivalent to 4e level 1, and from there 5e's next 17 levels roughly approximate the next 10 or so levels of 4e, except wizards get a huge break, they benefit from all the rapid hit point increases, but they also get high level spells plus the 5e version of ritual casting, pretty sweet if you're a wizard! [/QUOTE]

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