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<blockquote data-quote="pemerton" data-source="post: 6656905" data-attributes="member: 42582">Just a point of clarification - I don't think I said boring and didn't intend to imply it. (I did say non-fantastical/magical, though.)See also my post not far upthread of this one - you're quoted in it - where I explain why I think &quot;objective&quot; DCs tend to&nbsp; lead to a somewhat technical or mechanistic/disenchanted world rather than a magical/fate/luck-vibed world.Moving from speculation about design to some personal taste - this is why I like RM and Burning Wheel, and can enjoy RQ (though find it almost too austere), and also 4e and (in a different but not radically different genre) Marvel Heroic, but find 3E and a certain sort of approach to AD&amp;D hard to handle.The first category of games (RM, BW, RQ) tend to produce the mechanistic world. This favours modernist fantasy (eg Conan-esque sword-and-sorcery - REH's imagined world I find very disenchanted, despite the presence of magic, although Hour of the Dragon has hints to the contrary). I did eventually work out how to run RM so as to produce a different sort of vibe, but it is not easy and, because it pushes quite a bit against elements of the system, requires deft handling.These games don't mean boredom, though.4e and MHRP are at the other end of the spectrum - very fantastical worlds.My issue with 3E, and a certain style of AD&amp;D, is that the hit point system (and in AD&amp;D the saving throw system too) point towards fantasticality, but 3E's skill and combat manoeuvre system tends to point towards a mechanistic, disenchanted world. (And AD&amp;D can be pushed in this sort of direction too.) I find it a bit oil-and-water.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="pemerton, post: 6656905, member: 42582"] Just a point of clarification - I don't think I said [I]boring[/I] and didn't intend to imply it. (I did say non-fantastical/magical, though.) See also my post not far upthread of this one - you're quoted in it - where I explain why I think "objective" DCs tend to lead to a somewhat technical or mechanistic/disenchanted world rather than a magical/fate/luck-vibed world. Moving from speculation about design to some personal taste - this is why I like RM and Burning Wheel, and can enjoy RQ (though find it almost too austere), and also 4e and (in a different but not radically different genre) Marvel Heroic, but find 3E and a certain sort of approach to AD&D hard to handle. The first category of games (RM, BW, RQ) tend to produce the mechanistic world. This favours modernist fantasy (eg Conan-esque sword-and-sorcery - REH's imagined world I find [I]very[/I] disenchanted, despite the presence of magic, although Hour of the Dragon has hints to the contrary). I did eventually work out how to run RM so as to produce a different sort of vibe, but it is not easy and, because it pushes quite a bit against elements of the system, requires deft handling. These games don't mean boredom, though. 4e and MHRP are at the other end of the spectrum - very fantastical worlds. My issue with 3E, and a certain style of AD&D, is that the hit point system (and in AD&D the saving throw system too) point towards fantasticality, but 3E's skill and combat manoeuvre system tends to point towards a mechanistic, disenchanted world. (And AD&D can be pushed in this sort of direction too.) I find it a bit oil-and-water. [/QUOTE]

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