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<blockquote data-quote="I'm A Banana" data-source="post: 6658657" data-attributes="member: 2067">Sounds like you've got a bad case of Older Edition Itis - presuming that something works in 5e like it worked before 5e.&nbsp; You could invis the thief, but you'd probably be wasting a spell slot. Invis doesn't do a hell of a lot for stealth. It gives you the opportunity to stealth (makes you unseen), but it doesn't actually make them any better on their Dexterity (Stealth) roll. In any situation where you're not sneaking up on a creature with 360-degree vision in a featureless room, invis is kind of bupkiss, since &quot;being unseen&quot; is also handled by rocks, low hills, corners, sneaking up behind someone, etc. If you've got invis prepared, it's better to use it after the thief makes its first sneak attack, to protect the lil' guy until the rest of the party bursts out from around the corner. Another competitor for &quot;stealing the thunder from skills&quot; at 2nd level is Levitate, and there you also have the basic formula of &quot;the spell doesn't make the skill any better&quot; - anyone who wants to do anything other than float straight up (and perhaps come crashing down) had better have a halfway-decent Athletics roll. Knock is more useful - it bypasses the skill roll - but it comes with one HELL of a down-side, and it doesn't even open the door, so everything else gets a chance to react before you do. Spider Climb is probably the most useful exploration spell at that level - bypass the skill check and no significant downside - but the fact that it only works on one critter at a time means you can blow every 2nd level slot in your arsenal on it and still someone has to make an Athletics check to climb (and it's none too great for long climbs...or for getting back down...). It's useful, but it's pretty limited. It can help the scout out. And then hooray, you helped someone else be awesome for one encounter. And there's five left...it's gonna be a long day.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="I'm A Banana, post: 6658657, member: 2067"] Sounds like you've got a bad case of Older Edition Itis - presuming that something works in 5e like it worked before 5e. You could invis the thief, but you'd probably be wasting a spell slot. Invis doesn't do a hell of a lot for stealth. It gives you the opportunity to stealth (makes you unseen), but it doesn't actually make them any better on their Dexterity (Stealth) roll. In any situation where you're not sneaking up on a creature with 360-degree vision in a featureless room, invis is kind of bupkiss, since "being unseen" is also handled by rocks, low hills, corners, sneaking up behind someone, etc. If you've got invis prepared, it's better to use it [I]after[/I] the thief makes its first sneak attack, to protect the lil' guy until the rest of the party bursts out from around the corner. Another competitor for "stealing the thunder from skills" at 2nd level is [I]Levitate[/I], and there you also have the basic formula of "the spell doesn't make the skill any better" - anyone who wants to do anything other than float straight up (and perhaps come crashing down) had better have a halfway-decent Athletics roll. [I]Knock[/I] is more useful - it bypasses the skill roll - but it comes with one HELL of a down-side, and it doesn't even open the door, so everything else gets a chance to react before you do. [I]Spider Climb[/I] is probably the most useful exploration spell at that level - bypass the skill check and no significant downside - but the fact that it only works on one critter at a time means you can blow every 2nd level slot in your arsenal on it and [I]still[/I] someone has to make an Athletics check to climb (and it's none too great for long climbs...or for getting back [I]down...[/I]). It's useful, but it's pretty limited. It can help the scout out. And then [I]hooray[/I], you helped someone else be awesome for one encounter. And there's five left...it's gonna be a long day. [/QUOTE]

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