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<blockquote data-quote="I'm A Banana" data-source="post: 9257546" data-attributes="member: 2067">I do think the disconnect you point out is part of why the subclass isn't too popular IMXP. Thieves and swashbucklers can have mostly aesthetic bonuses and be fine, but part of an assassin's aesthetic is killing things quickly, and your first abilities don't seem to let you kill things more quickly than anyone else, really. I mean, they reward you for being quick (and help you to be quick), but the kill things aspect that is, aesthetically, why one may want to be an assassin...isn't strong. And kind of can't be, thanks to balance.Add to that how much the subclass's aesthetic relies on striking from stealth, and how stealth in 5e plays a little loose in its combat effects (there's no surprise round, so maybe your surprise attack from stealth does bupkiss, I guess, roll better initiative), and you've got something that can be...not what you envisioned.I think it might be an interesting experiment to add some disabling effect to the Assassin's Assassinate feature. Like, if the target survives, it is stunned for a round. Maybe tether it to a CON save. Like a one-turn, non-repeatable stunning fist effect. Get the drop on the red dragon and it's going to (a) feel it and (b) not immediately breathe fire on you, because you managed to knock it for a loop. That feels powerful, but it's not too much (especially with a save and the fact that it only works sometimes on the first turn).</blockquote>

[QUOTE="I'm A Banana, post: 9257546, member: 2067"] I do think the disconnect you point out is part of [I]why[/I] the subclass isn't too popular IMXP. Thieves and swashbucklers can have mostly aesthetic bonuses and be fine, but part of an assassin's aesthetic is killing things quickly, and your first abilities don't seem to let you kill things more quickly than anyone else, really. I mean, they reward you for being quick (and help you to be quick), but the kill things aspect that is, aesthetically, why one may want to be an assassin...isn't strong. And kind of can't be, thanks to balance. Add to that how much the subclass's aesthetic relies on striking from stealth, and how stealth in 5e plays a little loose in its combat effects (there's no surprise round, so maybe your surprise attack from stealth does bupkiss, I guess, roll better initiative), and you've got something that can be...not what you envisioned. I think it might be an interesting experiment to add some disabling effect to the Assassin's Assassinate feature. Like, if the target survives, it is stunned for a round. Maybe tether it to a CON save. Like a one-turn, non-repeatable stunning fist effect. Get the drop on the red dragon and it's going to (a) feel it and (b) not immediately breathe fire on you, because you managed to knock it for a [I]loop[/I]. That feels powerful, but it's not too much (especially with a save and the fact that it only works [I]sometimes[/I] on the first turn). [/QUOTE]

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