Why Prestige Classes?

[DragonLancer]

First off, this isn't a dig at PrC's or those who play them. Its just a asking a question that often comes to mind when I read D&D forums.

What happened to characters with 20 levels of core classes? Why is it that the majority of players always seem to go for them?

By their very name, Prestige, they should be rare, shouldn't they?

 

[Laslo Tremaine]

I think they did not go far enough with prestige classes.

If I had designed 3e, I would have had four 10 level core classes (cleric, fighter, rogue, wizard), and then all other classes would have been prestige.

I also think it is important to differentiate what is rare for the world and what is rare for a player character. Prestige classes may be fairly rare in the campaign world, but it is usually assumed that player characters are rare and unique individuals in that world.

 

[BryonD]

First off, this isn't a dig at PrC's or those who play them. Its just a asking a question that often comes to mind when I read D&D forums.

What happened to characters with 20 levels of core classes? Why is it that the majority of players always seem to go for them?

By their very name, Prestige, they should be rare, shouldn't they?

First, in my experience more than 50% of players stay with core classes. I believe that many other here have had somewhat similair experience. Not saying there are not many expections......

Second, just because many players may take *A* prestige class, does not mean that each individual class is not rare and still prestigious.

 

[Neo]

I dont know about rare, some certainly are but most are just specialised variations on the base classes, so dont necessarily count as rare as so much as uneasy to enter.

For my own game I require the players to actively play thier characters towards any prestige classes they want, seeking out trainers or tutors or mentors, or joining the necessary organisations and furthering the necessary causes etc.. as I cannot abide the notion of players saying "well I meet the requirements so I think i'll take a level in Black Fisted Warrior of the Fabled Sepulchre this time" with no story or indication from previous play that such a choice would be warrunted or justified or even available requirements or no.

 

[WayneLigon]

What happened to characters with 20 levels of core classes? Why is it that the majority of players always seem to go for them?

I know of very few people that stick with a single class. The only reason to do so before was that there was no real alternative unless you were a non-human. Now, people want to experiment more.

 

[Umbran]

What happened to characters with 20 levels of core classes? Why is it that the majority of players always seem to go for them?

I think the trick here is "seem". Are you sure that more players are going for PrCs, or are you only hearing more talk about the PrCs? Or, is the PrC talk the thing that sticks in your mind more? In essence - do you have more than anecdotal evidence for the seeming? If not, take it with a grain of salt. There's a million and more gamers out there. How many of us really have a sample good enough to know what the majority is really doing?

By their very name, Prestige, they should be rare, shouldn't they?

Ah, but high-level adventurers are also rare, and players play them all the time. Typically, the PCs are not normal people in the world. They are rare types, exceptional themselves, and should be expected to follow exceptional paths.

 

[DragonLancer]

Thankyou for your comments so far. It could well be that I am reading more and more about PrC's on various message boards than I was say a year ago (prior to 3.5). Theres a lot more about since then as well.

In my current campaign now just hitting 10th level, only two characters have taken a PrC, which is the same as the last 3.0 campaign I ran (of the two, one has taken a PrC this time as well).

I dont know about rare, some certainly are but most are just specialised variations on the base classes

Ah, yes. So, slight change of direction.
Under 3.0 prestige classes were there to reflect specific Orders, or roles, within a given campaign setting. Under 3.5 I have noticed a change in this. No longer are they a DM resource, but have become fairly standard player resources. They don't represent setting specific roles as much, but are more specilisations of a given core class.

Personally I prefer the former idea, but thats a different discussion. Why do you think they changed? Was it because of players, or a decison by writers and publishers to include them as such?

 

[Ranger REG]

By their very name, Prestige, they should be rare, shouldn't they?

Well, that's why the rules for it is in the Dungeon Master's Guide. It's up to the DM to decide if he want them in his campaign world. If he decided to allow them, tweak the class so it is campaign-specific. For example, a DM could take the duelist PrC and limited it to members of the swordsmen's guild called the Brotherhood of the Blade. By all means, add further roleplaying requirement like physically joining the Brotherhood and offering an annual tithe.

IOW, prestige class have always been a variant rule.

 

[Arcane Runes Press]

Ah, yes. So, slight change of direction.
Under 3.0 prestige classes were there to reflect specific Orders, or roles, within a given campaign setting. Under 3.5 I have noticed a change in this. No longer are they a DM resource, but have become fairly standard player resources. They don't represent setting specific roles as much, but are more specilisations of a given core class.

Personally I prefer the former idea, but thats a different discussion. Why do you think they changed? Was it because of players, or a decison by writers and publishers to include them as such?

Well, personally, I disregarded the idea of solely using PrCs to represent "specific orders, or roles" within a campaign a long time ago, well before I started working in the d20 industry full time.

I've always found that concept unrealistic and overly limiting, and too limited to the DMs whims. Prestige classes are neat, their abilities are neat, and limiting them to orders which the DM will introduce in play if he feels like it smacks too much of 1st edition NPC only classes like the Jester, and Archer-Ranger.

Patrick Y.

 

[Sejs]

If I had designed 3e, I would have had four 10 level core classes (cleric, fighter, rogue, wizard), and then all other classes would have been prestige.

Why not go a step further and use the generic classes from UA, and make everything that's more refined-of-concept a PrC? Generic classes give you your fighty guy, your casty guy and your skilly guy without saying that, for instance, all arcane spell casters have to use int and use prepared slots.