Why the D20 system has no merits and flaws system ?

[Cybern]

i agree. d20 has no merit.

ROTFL!

 

[Hawkshere]

What I'd like to read more about is the flaw system in 7th Sea. There you have to spend points for flaws, but when the flaw is evoked you get exp for roleplay (assuming you roleplay it). I like that system.

AEG also uses a version of this in Spycraft. Very easy to adapt to D&D.

 

[Psion]

AEG also uses a version of this in Spycraft. Very easy to adapt to D&D.

I dunno. I'm a little shaky on spycraft's version. They expect you to trade skill points permanently for XP in the short run. I think the balance is a little off.

 

[Kilmore]

I find oftentimes that players often bring their own flaws and weaknesses, as well as their strengths and merits, to the gaming table when they play their PC's. No need for rules.

 

[Seule]

I dislike allowing people to take flaws to become more powerful, as people have mentioned it quickly gets out of hand. 7th Sea's method of paying for your flaws for longer term benefits (extra XP when they come up) works well, but not every system needs merits/flaws. Every system had them for a while, but they've gone back out of favour.
As far as I'm concerned, if you take a RP penalty, I'll give you a RP benefit to balance.

--Seule

 

[LightPhoenix]

Ok, but since game balance is a chronic disease we're all infected with since 3e, then you can't play a rich princess who's 1st level.

If you think game balance is a chronic disease, then don't play 3E. Simple enough.

As for a shy charismatic person, I would definitely call myself that. I have a strong sense of self, I'm good at conversing with people, and I'm good at convincing people my way is best. I just get very uncomfortable around people I don't know very well. Once I loosen up I'm fine.

I don't think that story/character oriented stuff needs to be mechanically represented. There's a reason one of the key points of creating a prestige class is, "roleplaying restrictions do not balance mechanical benefits." I see no reason why that's not true for any aspect of the system, including flaws.

 

[Goobermunch]

Here's my big problem with Merits and Flaws. Generally Merits are abilities of general applicability. Flaws are highly conditional weaknesses. It means that merits will come into use all the time, while it's possible to run the life of a character without ever encountering the triggering event for the Flaw . . . unless the DM takes the time out to screw your character.

--G

 

[Cybern]

It means that merits will come into use all the time, while it's possible to run the life of a character without ever encountering the triggering event for the Flaw . . . unless the DM takes the time out to screw your character.

Mine does.

As for the chronic disease, I am infected, so I like it

I thought it sounded sarcastic, sorry.

 

[Cybern]

I don't think that story/character oriented stuff needs to be mechanically represented.

Well, +2/+2 feats DO have names that sound like story/character, background-oriented.

But what about a one-legged character? I'd like to play one (maybe even a Monk!), but how is it to be balanced? I'm not talking house rule or DM's judgement, but how to? For newbies?

 

[Nightfall]

My problem with Merits and Flaws stems mainly from the WoD experiences. No matter what people ALWAYS took some minor flaw that might have some RP value but they NEVER freaking got close to it! They only did it so they could get more benefits/skills/etc and that's all. It had NOTHING to do role play. Comparatively speaking, in my online SL games, I've had FAR more rping done than any real life games, mainly BECAUSE flaws and merits weren't necessary. So to me this whole argument for a Flaws and merits system is quite specious and also unwarrented. As for making them apart of the core rules, I just think if it's done it will only be because munkins want more stuff. I'm happy with things they way they are now. Or if I want to use such a system (doubtful) I'll make DAMN sure the penalities MEAN something other than "I'm a lush" or "I like having mass orgies." Cause honestly it won't work in ANY game in practice. Of that I have a mountain of experience to back me up on.