Wildshape

[Li Shenron]

One option would be to do what they did with Turn Undead for the Cleric - make Wildshape a spell that's always available to the druid, but requires the use of a spell slot to cast. You could even have different level versions for more powerful wild shapes.

I am not sure I like it for Turn Undead, but for Wildshape it might work. After all it's not that different from the polymorph spells.

BTW, Animal Friendship was a spell in 3.0, and IMHO it worked even then, although it was very different because since it had a permanent duration then the fact that you needed to prepare it worked mostly for giving the druid a 1-day delay before summoning a new animal companion.

 

[1of3]

What [MENTION=40176]MarkB[/MENTION] says about wildshaping being a spell.

Also I doubt that all Druids will have animal companions. They already removed familiars from Wizards, probably because some players really hate having pets. So either animal companion will be build option for the class or go all the way to Specialty. The latter is even more probable because elements shared by classes have already been moved to specialty (Familiars, Necromancer, Two-Weapon Fighting...).

 

[Li Shenron]

Also I doubt that all Druids will have animal companions. They already removed familiars from Wizards, probably because some players really hate having pets. So either animal companion will be build option for the class or go all the way to Specialty. The latter is even more probable because elements shared by classes have already been moved to specialty (Familiars, Necromancer, Two-Weapon Fighting...).

You are right, Specialty might be better... This way Animal Companion will be available to Druids, Rangers and possibly even everybody else (remains to be seen what requisites they add to the feat). After all animal companions are not exactly special or magical, just more loyal and attuned (therefore controllable) than a bought & trained animal.

 

[whearp]

You are right, Specialty might be better... This way Animal Companion will be available to Druids, Rangers and possibly even everybody else (remains to be seen what requisites they add to the feat). After all animal companions are not exactly special or magical, just more loyal and attuned (therefore controllable) than a bought & trained animal.

I'm probably going to be lynched for even suggesting this, but it seems to me that the prerequisite would be the ability to cast primal spells. I know plenty of folks don't like the power sources from 4e, but I just think that it's time to go on and codify primal magic in a more classic format. Having three basic forms of magic just makes sense thematically. Clerics and Paladins use divine magic granted to them through investiture. Wizards and sorcerers twist the raw powers of the cosmos. Druids and Rangers are able to borrow and utilize the very essence of nature itself. It just makes sense lore-wise, and solves problems mechanically... the way I see it, at least.

 

[triqui]

The problem with druidzilla was that there was so much druids could do and could do very well. They could shapechange. They could cast spells. They had an animal companion. And they could do that all from a low level.

All of that is pretty essential to the druid. I don't think they could do what they did in 4e and remove elements from the druid and have it feel as iconic or edition neutral.
So the cleric fix of splitting it into builds is less optimal.

Personally, I think they should design the druid so you choose your speciality at first level (wildshaping, pets, spells) and then gain additional specialities at higher levels, albeit weaker. Or just keep focusing on a single speciality and unlocking mastery bonuses.

Not only that, but they gained the animal stats. So if you choose a dire bear, you sudenly gain +16 to STR and +8 CON. That makes the balance jump off the window, because a Barbarian gains +4 STR and CON with rage, and the druid can cast firestorm, call lightning, barkskin and regeneration.

 

[Minigiant]

One thing I think might work is Druidic styles. Similar to 3.5 Ranger style, at a certain level, a druid can which of his of her class features get better.

The druid could get talent points like a Console RPG or MMORPG and be forced to choose whether their features increase.

Each level a druid could learn a spell, gain a form, or add HD to the animal companions.

 

[Li Shenron]

I'm probably going to be lynched for even suggesting this, but it seems to me that the prerequisite would be the ability to cast primal spells. I know plenty of folks don't like the power sources from 4e, but I just think that it's time to go on and codify primal magic in a more classic format. Having three basic forms of magic is just makes sense thematically. Clerics and Paladins use divine magic granted to them through investiture. Wizards and sorcerers twist the raw powers of the cosmos. Druids and Rangers are able to borrow and utilize the very essence of nature itself. It just makes sense lore-wise, and solves problems mechanically... the way I see it, at least.

What exactly is the difference between primal and arcane magic?

 

[triqui]

What exactly is the difference between primal and arcane magic?

Have you played Runequest? The same difference than between spirit magic and sorcery.

 

[whearp]

What exactly is the difference between primal and arcane magic?

There is an artificial aspect to arcane magic. A wizard, sorcerer, or warlock impose their will over magic to create a desired effect. A practitioner of primal magic makes use of natural effects harmoniously.

In this way, you can kind of think about magic as all being the same force, but the types simply defining how it is acquired and used.

Divine Magic is gained though investiture, lent from the gods to perform their work.

Arcane Magic is defined by the will of the individual, usually through careful study or mastery of one's innate abilities.

Primal Magic is neither given nor taken, but representative of the caster's connection and harmony with the innate natural forces around him or her.

This is just my thoughts on the matter, and should not be taken as any statement of understood fact.

 

[Mattachine]

Wildshape can easily stay in the game, as long as wildshape's power is defined by stats, not "any animal in the book". That is how wildshape worked in late 3.5's PHB2: "the shape looks like whatever you like, but here is the best abilities you can get".

Fourth edition did something similar: wildshape was essentially cosmetic, unless you used a spell or ability to get a shape that actually had useful powers (tiny size, flight, swimming, etc).

As far back as AD&D, the idea of assuming whatever form is available in the book was awesome, but overpowered.

In my AD&D campaign, we had the druid character routinely wildshape into a wooly mammoth after casting airwalk, protection from fire, and wall of fire (mobile ring shape, turned inward). GAH!