Wizards and Dungeon Maps: Gridline madness

[MerricB]

If there's one trait of recent Dungeon and Wizards of the Coast maps that I think should be stamped out utterly it is this: the lack of consideration for how useful the grid is for DMs.

There are three problems that occur.

1) The Use of 5 foot grids
2) The use of 'accurate' walls measuring 2-4 foot in scale
3) Walls not running along grid lines.

When printed, 5' grids often end up at about 2 or 3 mm on the page, and the walls have no relation to them at all. It makes determining the room size and describing it to the players for their mapping extremely difficult.

When you add this to the tendency to size walls correctly at 2-4 feet thick, it makes the description of those maps almost impossible.

Realistic? Yes. Functional? No.

To be readable in D&D terms, I need a map to have clear grid markings, walls that run along the gridlines, and a grid of squares that is about 4-5 mm, normally representing 10' squares. (4-5 mm representing 5' squares doesn't bother me).

The odd exception doesn't bother me - I accept that walls can be occasionally be placed in weird places - but when the entire map is like that...

Here is one of the Map-a-week from Wizards websites. The gridlines are nicely sized here (thankfully). Unfortunately, they don't always have much relationship to the walls.

http://www.wizards.com/dnd/images/mapofweek/05dwarvenfortdng_72dpi_233dhs.jpg

Look at the top right-hand room, and the passage leading south from it. What is going on here? Why are the gridlines in the middle of the corridor?

It doesn't add to playability, that's for sure.

Here's another map:

http://www.wizards.com/dnd/images/mapofweek/maincatacomblower_72dpi.jpg

Now, this one is nicely aligned with the grids, and is much easier to describe and use.

For an example of the small 5' grid madness, I suggest you have a look at the main map in the Sunless Citadel

Am I alone in feeling this?

Cheers!

 

[Vrecknidj]

I feel the same way. That's one reason why I either make my own maps, or modify others' maps to my own liking. It's a drag, and I wish that the cartographers would just dump any aim for realism and just go for practicality for the DM. (Besides, there's very little about the D&D dungeon that's realistic.)

Dave

 

[Quasqueton]

I appreciate the effort the cartographers put into make the map look realistic and "cool" on paper, but only the DM sees it. I would much prefer a simply drawn map that fit and lined up with the grid. The old AD&D blue maps were perfect in this way.

I've found the randomly generated maps from various web sites to be more useful than the stylized published maps.

Shadows, bricks, cracks, etc. just make it harder to work with the maps at a glance. I usually like to use a published map and fill the dungeon with my own content, but I haven't used a single published map since D&D3 came out.

Quasqueton

 

[Conaill]

Hear, hear!

It seems like too many mapmakers (and especially at WotC) take the easy way out, and just overlay a grid willy-nilly on the map. There's really no good reason why the grid has to line up in different parts of the map. For example, if you have a diagonal corridor, why not put a grid on it that's lines up with the corridor? Ditto for curved corridors: I have no problem with a curved grid for those. Sure, it'll take a little extra time, but it's so much more functional!

 

[MacMathan]

I agree whole heartedly. The testing/editing of a module should include trying to actually draw the map included for play.

One of the hardest to use that I have found was the map in the Standing Stone module of the 3e adventure path.

As a Dungeon/Dragon subscriber I hope that they endeavor to fix this.

 

[MerricB]

There's something weird about the Standing Stone map... I don't know quite what it is...

Cheers!

 

[coyote6]

You're obviously not alone, but I don't really agree. I think that after a very little while, endless maps that line up to a 5 ft. grid would annoy me, and provoke snarkiness. "Say, why is it that in the whole of the Flannaes, no one builds in anything other than five foot increments? We could make a killing building doors less than five feet wide!"

Edit: I will agree, however, that the maps in Standing Stone mostly, ah, Inhaled Vigorously, shall we say?

The maze map in particular is memorable for its spiraling un-goodness.

 

[JDragon]

Gotta agree on this one, mostly.

Only thing I disagree on is the size of the grid. If its inside or going to have combat going on in the area keep it to 5' squares.

If its outside, then a larger scale is fine, for a town or very large structure for example.

The worst WotC product I have come across is the maps of the CRM area of Return to the Temple of Elemental Evil. My players laugh at me as I swear about the lousy maps as I prep for a figth. If I have not redrawn the maps to 5' scale and figured out the weirdness of the area it can take for ever to draw out a combat area.

Now I realize that with an area the size the CRM is, it tough to have a nice 5' scale map, but at 20' with dark lines and 10' with light it kills me. Then add the random cave shapes and that one map of the area does not line up with the next (and theres like 12 maps making up the CRM) also bugs in a big way.


Keep the maps simple and easy to translate to a battlemat, espically since the game its self has gone more & more toward using minis.

Spend the money on nice B&W or color handouts that the players will see.

 

[MerricB]

I don't mind 5 foot square grids as long as the actual squares on the page are 4 or 5 mm.

When they're 2 mm or so (as many are), you can't make them out at all!

Cheers!

 

[MerricB]

You're obviously not alone, but I don't really agree. I think that after a very little while, endless maps that line up to a 5 ft. grid would annoy me, and provoke snarkiness. "Say, why is it that in the whole of the Flannaes, no one builds in anything other than five foot increments? We could make a killing building doors less than five feet wide!"

Do you describe the dimensions of rooms for your players, or do you just give them the map?

Cheers!