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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Neonchameleon" data-source="post: 9110303" data-attributes="member: 87792">I'm not sure anyone is saying that they suck in terms of power. It's simply that thematically all wizards are basically the same; high complexity, low variety. And because they pick from the same spell list and only have very limited changes to their spells from the subclasses and because spells are an in character choice a wizard is about as interesting as a single sorcerer subclass.And this is an example of the problem. Your first wizard is a has a very strong claim to be the best ritual caster in the game (the only other candidate being a tomelock) and is a fun choice. Your second wizard? They are either going to pick all the same spells they don't prepare as the first wizard or they are going to be leaving a lot of power on the table.Even the wizard subclasses don't offer that much. They are better than the previous subclasses, but in an irony you're better off not picking spells from your specialist school when you level up so you gain the cost advantage. Let's look at what each in turn does to change your spell selection from other than a "vanilla wizard" set.<ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Abjuration: You will cast Mage Armour at the start of the day (for 2xlevel + Int thp). Other than that gain 2thp/spell level for casting an abjuration spell. Mage Armour, Shield, Absorb Elements, Counterspell, and Dispel Magic are all good candidates for the vanilla wizard kit anyway so you just gain from taking the spells a vanilla wizard would.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Conjuration: Benign Transposition recharges on a ritual - all this incentivises you to do is cast Tenser's Floating Disk or Unseen Servant whenever you have a spare ten minutes.  The sort of rituals vanilla wizards cast anyway. And the summons boosts come late.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Divination: This school might change the spells you actually cast by lowering the effective cost for a divination spell from one slot to one spell level.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Enchantment: No reason at all to change your spells before level 10. There are some fine spells to use it on - but they are almost all already on the generic wizard shortlist. And 90% of games end by level 10.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Evocation: OK, yes, keeping your allies safe from your fireballs can affect how you play and which spells you cast.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Illusion: Malleable illusion is a genuine hit. Yes, this school does impact your spell selections.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Necromancy: Precisely one spell is affected in the first thirteen levels. Animate Dead.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Transmutation: Polymorph - for which you get a bonus use. It's a great spell anyway.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">War Magic: Damage spells, Dispel Magic, and Counterspell synergy. This is probably the most vanilla of subclasses.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Order of Scribes: Nope</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Bladesinger: Nope</li> </ul>And that's the issue. The wizard spell meta is the wizard spell meta for all subclasses, and the only subclass that might push you off that meta by more than about two spells is the Illusionist. And spell selection is an in-character decision; you can't just limit a wizard to these spells because that's what the magic does and have it feel non-arbitrary for the character. Meanwhile take the sorcerer. Two storm sorcerers might have the same list - but will be different from two aberrant minds from two clockwork souls from two divine sorcerers from two "vanilla" (dragon/wild/shadow) sorcerers. And the warlock gains extra possible spells from their patron.By being so powerful and so flexible the base wizard class specialises less - and therefore two wizards come out looking a lot more similar than any other primary caster. And are therefore less interesting to play again than any other caster.</blockquote>

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