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*Pathfinder & Starfinder
Wizkids should take the Pathfinder 1.0 ruleset and publish their own RPG.
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<blockquote data-quote="Aldarc" data-source="post: 7808232" data-attributes="member: 5142"><p>I said that <em>a lot of games</em> (i.e., not all games) are just retreading similar ideas and reskinning ideas and mechanics not that some of them aren't innovating. You are attempting to falsify a different hypothesis than the one that was put forth, hence why I find your argument to come across as pedantic. </p><p></p><p>I would have hoped you have understood why the analogy was not irrelevant - boy was I mistaken - because it is illustrative of the sort nitpicky, pedantic games that you are trying to play. "Ah ha! You are moving when you breath," is on a similar level as "Ah ha! There is a slightly new mechanic in this game so it innovated." </p><p></p><p>It seems to me that if you were "taking it at face value and I am approaching it from a fair and reasonable viewpoint" then you wouldn't be trying to play these pedantic games. </p><p></p><p>Sure. </p><p></p><p>When you look at it in detail, it's less of an actual mechanic and more story fluff that is meant to provide an in-game hook for your character. What is the actual impact of play for this mechanic? It's kinda underwhelming given the relative emphasis the Kickstarter had on this. You can find a more robust version of "Epic Paths" with Primeval Thule's "Character Narratives," which are also similar to the ladders you mention below. </p><p></p><p>Now correct me if I am wrong, but isn't Ultramodern5 just the 5e update/conversion of Ultramodern4 that was written for the 4th Edition D&D OGL? And was it not this prior iteration of Ultramodern that innovated the idea of ladders that would coexist with your class choice? And aren't these ladders not an iteration of the Character Themes from 4e Dark Sun? <img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite24" alt=":unsure:" title="Unsure :unsure:" loading="lazy" data-shortname=":unsure:" /> </p><p></p><p>Regarding lifepaths, they even say it themselves in the book that lifepaths are just an expansion of backgrounds. From what I can tell, lifepaths seem to repackage a similar idea from Traveller albeit stripped of any mechanical weight as it applies to generating a character's backstory fluff. </p><p></p><p>Didn't Imaro and Parmandur establish earlier in this thread that the DMG already has its own optional mechanics for this? <img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite2" alt=";)" title="Wink ;)" loading="lazy" data-shortname=";)" /> </p><p></p><p>I can save you some time and say that I believe that Pugmire is probably one of the more innovative offerings because it crunches the game to 10 levels, streamlines some aspects of the game (though arguably not enough), and while also deconstructing the game and its character options. (It does reskin a lot though.) If it was decoupled from its somewhat charming anthromorphic setting and deconstructed further, then it would have a lot of potential as a 5e Accelerated or even as the basis for a revitalized 5e Modern. </p><p></p><p>(1) I have enough self-awareness to recognize that this answer is contextualized on the sort of game that I would want to run. (2) My players have never approached me as a GM requesting to use 3pp for 5e so it has never come up.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Aldarc, post: 7808232, member: 5142"] I said that [I]a lot of games[/I] (i.e., not all games) are just retreading similar ideas and reskinning ideas and mechanics not that some of them aren't innovating. You are attempting to falsify a different hypothesis than the one that was put forth, hence why I find your argument to come across as pedantic. I would have hoped you have understood why the analogy was not irrelevant - boy was I mistaken - because it is illustrative of the sort nitpicky, pedantic games that you are trying to play. "Ah ha! You are moving when you breath," is on a similar level as "Ah ha! There is a slightly new mechanic in this game so it innovated." It seems to me that if you were "taking it at face value and I am approaching it from a fair and reasonable viewpoint" then you wouldn't be trying to play these pedantic games. Sure. When you look at it in detail, it's less of an actual mechanic and more story fluff that is meant to provide an in-game hook for your character. What is the actual impact of play for this mechanic? It's kinda underwhelming given the relative emphasis the Kickstarter had on this. You can find a more robust version of "Epic Paths" with Primeval Thule's "Character Narratives," which are also similar to the ladders you mention below. Now correct me if I am wrong, but isn't Ultramodern5 just the 5e update/conversion of Ultramodern4 that was written for the 4th Edition D&D OGL? And was it not this prior iteration of Ultramodern that innovated the idea of ladders that would coexist with your class choice? And aren't these ladders not an iteration of the Character Themes from 4e Dark Sun? :unsure: Regarding lifepaths, they even say it themselves in the book that lifepaths are just an expansion of backgrounds. From what I can tell, lifepaths seem to repackage a similar idea from Traveller albeit stripped of any mechanical weight as it applies to generating a character's backstory fluff. Didn't Imaro and Parmandur establish earlier in this thread that the DMG already has its own optional mechanics for this? ;) I can save you some time and say that I believe that Pugmire is probably one of the more innovative offerings because it crunches the game to 10 levels, streamlines some aspects of the game (though arguably not enough), and while also deconstructing the game and its character options. (It does reskin a lot though.) If it was decoupled from its somewhat charming anthromorphic setting and deconstructed further, then it would have a lot of potential as a 5e Accelerated or even as the basis for a revitalized 5e Modern. (1) I have enough self-awareness to recognize that this answer is contextualized on the sort of game that I would want to run. (2) My players have never approached me as a GM requesting to use 3pp for 5e so it has never come up. [/QUOTE]
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Community
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Wizkids should take the Pathfinder 1.0 ruleset and publish their own RPG.
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