Reply to thread

Message

<blockquote data-quote="Umbran" data-source="post: 7808295" data-attributes="member: 177">This is oft-touted, but does not ring true.Let us be honest - to make this claim for D&amp;D, we have to contort ourselves around making large swaths of game-rule information an in-game construct, such that every PC is actually carrying a copy of Mordenkainen's &quot;Howe Thee Worlde Reallye Workes&quot; in their adventurer's packs.&nbsp; That book looks remarkably like a PHB, classifying spells in levels, and not batting an eye on how Druid and wizard spells have exactly the same effects, discussing how adventurer toughness seems to be quantified in levels, their toughness modeled with dice of varying sizes...&nbsp; And, of course, the assertion that we don't metagame flies out the window when you get to the folks who love the tactical wargame, detailed movement, and playing the detailed rules, where all the characters go about like a well-oiled machine, even though they aren't able to communicate in detail in six seconds what everyone is going to do....Moreover, most adventuring parties would quickly fall apart if they weren't driven by the players understanding that unless someone gets really egregious in their behavior, we all have to get along.&nbsp; Belkar would not be tolerated if we didn't metagame, but strangely, we all have Belkars (or some other thing we compromise on what we will work with for the good of the game) in our lives.&nbsp; So, the platitudes of how D&amp;D doesn't have metagaming are... platitudes, but not the general reality.If you really feel that somehow you work without any metagame considerations.... well fine.&nbsp; Go you!&nbsp;&nbsp; How confident are you that, if we walked through any convention game hall, or into any FLGS in the nation, and watched a game, I'd not be able to point out a dozen instances of metagame thinking in a given session?&nbsp; I don't think you should be at all confident about that.Given that, the question isn't about what the game encourages.&nbsp; It is about what the game will support.&nbsp; And, guess what?&nbsp; FATE will work fine if you limit yourself to non-metagame decisions.&nbsp; Your aspects can be chosen to describe entirely in-game abilities and backstory.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Umbran, post: 7808295, member: 177"] This is oft-touted, but does not ring true. Let us be honest - to make this claim for D&D, we have to contort ourselves around making large swaths of game-rule information an in-game construct, such that every PC is actually carrying a copy of Mordenkainen's "Howe Thee Worlde Reallye Workes" in their adventurer's packs. That book looks remarkably like a PHB, classifying spells in levels, and not batting an eye on how Druid and wizard spells have exactly the same effects, discussing how adventurer toughness seems to be quantified in levels, their toughness modeled with dice of varying sizes... And, of course, the assertion that we don't metagame flies out the window when you get to the folks who love the tactical wargame, detailed movement, and playing the detailed rules, where all the characters go about like a well-oiled machine, even though they aren't able to communicate in detail in six seconds what everyone is going to do.... Moreover, most adventuring parties would quickly fall apart if they weren't driven by the players understanding that unless someone gets really egregious in their behavior, we all have to get along. Belkar would not be tolerated if we didn't metagame, but strangely, we all have Belkars (or some other thing we compromise on what we will work with for the good of the game) in our lives. So, the platitudes of how D&D doesn't have metagaming are... platitudes, but not the general reality. If you [I]really[/I] feel that somehow you work without any metagame considerations.... well fine. Go you! How confident are you that, if we walked through any convention game hall, or into any FLGS in the nation, and watched a game, I'd not be able to point out a dozen instances of metagame thinking in a given session? I don't think you should be at all confident about that. Given that, the question isn't about what the game encourages. It is about what the game will support. And, guess what? FATE will work fine if you limit yourself to non-metagame decisions. Your aspects can be chosen to describe entirely in-game abilities and backstory. [/QUOTE]

Verification