Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Next
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
Twitch
YouTube
Facebook (EN Publishing)
Facebook (EN World)
Twitter
Instagram
TikTok
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
World-Building DMs
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="ProgBard" data-source="post: 6772968" data-attributes="member: 6803722"><p>The trouble is that all of the examples in the parenthetical are very different things.</p><p></p><p>Smoking, in 2015 (and for a while now), is something you never, ever do around people who are bothered by it, and never do without asking. Conscientious smokers (i.e., almost all of them) are super cognizant of this. No one is ever out of line to ask that it not be done in their living space or a space they're hosting. On the other hand, "don't have it on your person, and no stepping outside to indulge" - that's being a jerk.</p><p></p><p>Alcohol is its own complex situation. "Don't bring alcohol because I'm in recovery" is always a reasonable request. "Don't bring alcohol because we're Muslim/Southern Baptist/American Indian and there are long-standing cultural taboos about it" is also reasonable. These situations call on the guest to be respectful, and violating that is being a jerk of some magnitude. "Don't bring alcohol because we personally are teetotallers/went straightedge/think only losers indulge in the Demon Rum" is a fuzzier case. The hosts there are maybe at least edging towards jerkitude, even if it's probably better to accomodate them, and bringing a bottle anyway, maybe just to spite them, is a jerk move of its own.</p><p></p><p>Food restrictions are a different matter. A host who says "I don't/can't eat this and therefore no one at my party will either" is being a jerk. (Unless there's a genuine food allergy in play, of course, and passing contact is actually dangerous.) Potlucks have their own set of codes about these things; guests who are careful to label what they bring, provide lists of ingredients, stay mindful of cross-contamination, and clean up after themselves are playing well within the rules, and, in general, anyone who places tighter restrictions on them is likely to be at least a little out of line. (Although, again, there might be reasons of cultural taboo that provide for reasonable exceptions, such as a house that abides by halal or kosher laws.)</p><p></p><p>Music is where I'm pretty close to [MENTION=67338]GMforPowergamers[/MENTION] - you give a space for people to share what they like. "No rap/country/klezmer/what-have-you in MY house" is the stance of a snob and a jerk - which is to say, it may be within their <em>rights</em>, but it's still kind of an a-hole move. As long as one person's tastes don't dominate, and someone doesn't keep pushing something that everyone else clearly hates, this is a matter on which it's reasonable to expect there will a range of things present at your gathering. <em>However</em>, I can certainly imagine edge cases involving particularly incendiary subject matter, and asking people not to bring RAHOWA (which, why are you friends with these people?) or some especially misogynistic gangsta rap or cock-rock is perfectly reasonable. (Also, guests with particularly fringey tastes are <em>maybe</em> pushing the line of jerkitude by asking all their friends to be subjected to what they like. I don't go to parties and make everyone listen to <em>THRAKATTAK</em> or <em>Lucifer Over London</em>, and neither should you.)</p><p></p><p>So the answer to this question is: It's complicated. Welcome to the world.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Going to a party to do a specific thing and then trying to get everyone to do a specific other thing is being a jerk, yes.</p><p></p><p>(But note that these are, more or less, binary states. You're either watching the Super Bowl or you're not. There aren't really a lot of fine points to negotiate. The same goes for the Trek marathon, mostly, with the exception of deciding whether the resident linguist in your group is going to talk you into skipping "Darmok," and if you can make him shut up during the episode when you decide to watch it anyway.)</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>He's not taking anyone else's plans or ideas into consideration beyond "you're in or you're out"? Yeah, he's a tool. And maybe a candidate for the ex-friend list if this is the kind of crap he pulls a lot.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="ProgBard, post: 6772968, member: 6803722"] The trouble is that all of the examples in the parenthetical are very different things. Smoking, in 2015 (and for a while now), is something you never, ever do around people who are bothered by it, and never do without asking. Conscientious smokers (i.e., almost all of them) are super cognizant of this. No one is ever out of line to ask that it not be done in their living space or a space they're hosting. On the other hand, "don't have it on your person, and no stepping outside to indulge" - that's being a jerk. Alcohol is its own complex situation. "Don't bring alcohol because I'm in recovery" is always a reasonable request. "Don't bring alcohol because we're Muslim/Southern Baptist/American Indian and there are long-standing cultural taboos about it" is also reasonable. These situations call on the guest to be respectful, and violating that is being a jerk of some magnitude. "Don't bring alcohol because we personally are teetotallers/went straightedge/think only losers indulge in the Demon Rum" is a fuzzier case. The hosts there are maybe at least edging towards jerkitude, even if it's probably better to accomodate them, and bringing a bottle anyway, maybe just to spite them, is a jerk move of its own. Food restrictions are a different matter. A host who says "I don't/can't eat this and therefore no one at my party will either" is being a jerk. (Unless there's a genuine food allergy in play, of course, and passing contact is actually dangerous.) Potlucks have their own set of codes about these things; guests who are careful to label what they bring, provide lists of ingredients, stay mindful of cross-contamination, and clean up after themselves are playing well within the rules, and, in general, anyone who places tighter restrictions on them is likely to be at least a little out of line. (Although, again, there might be reasons of cultural taboo that provide for reasonable exceptions, such as a house that abides by halal or kosher laws.) Music is where I'm pretty close to [MENTION=67338]GMforPowergamers[/MENTION] - you give a space for people to share what they like. "No rap/country/klezmer/what-have-you in MY house" is the stance of a snob and a jerk - which is to say, it may be within their [i]rights[/i], but it's still kind of an a-hole move. As long as one person's tastes don't dominate, and someone doesn't keep pushing something that everyone else clearly hates, this is a matter on which it's reasonable to expect there will a range of things present at your gathering. [i]However[/i], I can certainly imagine edge cases involving particularly incendiary subject matter, and asking people not to bring RAHOWA (which, why are you friends with these people?) or some especially misogynistic gangsta rap or cock-rock is perfectly reasonable. (Also, guests with particularly fringey tastes are [i]maybe[/i] pushing the line of jerkitude by asking all their friends to be subjected to what they like. I don't go to parties and make everyone listen to [i]THRAKATTAK[/i] or [i]Lucifer Over London[/i], and neither should you.) So the answer to this question is: It's complicated. Welcome to the world. Going to a party to do a specific thing and then trying to get everyone to do a specific other thing is being a jerk, yes. (But note that these are, more or less, binary states. You're either watching the Super Bowl or you're not. There aren't really a lot of fine points to negotiate. The same goes for the Trek marathon, mostly, with the exception of deciding whether the resident linguist in your group is going to talk you into skipping "Darmok," and if you can make him shut up during the episode when you decide to watch it anyway.) He's not taking anyone else's plans or ideas into consideration beyond "you're in or you're out"? Yeah, he's a tool. And maybe a candidate for the ex-friend list if this is the kind of crap he pulls a lot. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
World-Building DMs
Top