XP for familiars?

[Jon_Dahl]

I've always thought that every single creature - even a simple frog - has an XP value. But now that my players defeated the hawk-familiar of a 5th-level sorcerer (who escaped unharmed) I find myself unable to determine exact XP. And since XP is the element that "drives the game" I'd like to get it right, or at least almost right.

Any quick & dirty way to calculate XP for familiars? Usually IF the master is defeated also, I wouldn't give separate XP for familiars (even for the improved and munchinized ones)... They are like a class ability for me - part of the wizard/sorcerer.

 

[Dandu]

I would not give much XP if any.

 

[irdeggman]

Nothing for familiars it is included in the CR of the sorcerer.

Same as for summoned creatures (see DMG pg 37 for summoned creatures exclusion).

The sorcerer suffered xp loss because of the death of his familiar so he was not unharmed. IN this cas minimum of 500 xp max of 1000 xp (250 per level fort save for 1/2)

"The sorcerer chooses the kind of familiar he gets. As the sorcerer advances in level, his familiar also increases in power.

If the familiar dies or is dismissed by the sorcerer, the sorcerer must attempt a DC 15 Fortitude saving throw. Failure means he loses 200 experience points per sorcerer level; success reduces the loss to one-half that amount.

However, a sorcerer’s experience point total can never go below 0 as the result of a familiar’s demise or dismissal. A slain or dismissed familiar cannot be replaced for a year and day. A slain familiar can be raised from the dead just as a character can be, and it does not lose a level or a Constitution point when this happy event occurs"


PHB pg 52 for info on familiars.

"Familiars are magically linked to their masters. In some sense, the
familiar and the master are practically one being"

Their hit points are 1/2 their masters, regardless of their hit dice.

 

[Jon_Dahl]

Hmmm, so there is no easy answer? And I do take my words back, the sorcerer was harmed because her familiar was killed (and very much so)

Any idea of how much XP 5th-level sorcerer's familiar is worth? So it is included in the masters CR... But what if the master "wins" and familiar "loses" (in effect, dies)?

 

[Vegepygmy]

Hmmm, so there is no easy answer?

The easy answer is zero.

But what if the master "wins" and familiar "loses" (in effect, dies)?

Still zero.

 

[irdeggman]

Any idea of how much XP 5th-level sorcerer's familiar is worth? So it is included in the masters CR... But what if the master "wins" and familiar "loses" (in effect, dies)?

Would you award xp if someone's intellgent sward was destroyed but they survived and got away?

A familiar should be treated like that - they do not gain xp, the only "advancement" a familiar gets is the increased benefits fro his master gaining a level.

If the familiar's master dies then they revert back to normal animal instead of a "magical" one.

The rules are fairly straitforward on things being treated as part of anotther creatures CR - again compare a familiar to a summoned creature.

If you absolutely feet you had to award xp then award xp for a "normal" creature not for what they became for being under the sorcerer's influence (it is like being under a super "buff" spell).

A hawk is a CR 1/3.

During a normal encounter a partly is assumed to use about 20-25% of their assets.

A familiar is an "asset" - it cost gp to summon and costs xp when lost.

So in a reverse scenario the party would have a certain amount of assets in the encounter.

What was the level of the part?

Assuming the party was 4 PCs at 5th level

The CR of a hawk would be 1/3 so the award would be 300/3 = 100 divided equally amoung the party members so roughly 25 xp each.

But again the rules lead you to believe that no xp should be awarded for defeating the familiar in and of itself.

That does not mean you can't award xp for other things - like overcoming a challenge. Did the party get past (i.e., overcome) what the challenge was supposed to be? If so then they should be award full xp based on the challenge for the encounter.

Did they accomplish a task or story point?

Etc.. . .

 

[jefgorbach]

generally speaking, RAW treats familiars as "equipment" owned by the sorcerer so defeating it separate from its master would NOT be worth XP even though they cant claim this particular "treasure".

However if you feel otherwise, the simplest way would be to award the party the amount of Xp the Sorcerer lost upon its death. Alternately, start with its normal animal base and boost for its accumulated buffs.

 

[the Jester]

In the rare event that a party fights a familiar yet never encounters the master, I'd probably treat the familar as having HD equal to 1/8 its hit points.

Generally, though, no xp.

 

[BENINHB]

How much XP did the Sorcerer lose for his familiar being destroyed?? I would divide that amount equally among the party.

 

[Theo R Cwithin]

No XP, because the familiar is a class feature, and is part of the sorc. (IOW, the xp value of the familiar is folded into the sorc's xp value according to his CR). In killing the familiar, the sorc is damaged but not defeated.

Another way to look at it: No xp would be awarded for destroying a fighter's weapon and draining him of a level, so I don't see why xp would be awarded for effectively destroying one of the sorc's weapons and doing him some xp damage.