(Yet another) Paladin behaviour question

[Westwind]

I know the ultimate answer to any Paladin code question is do what's right for your campaign, but I was wondering how people would handle this situation:

High level Paladin with Leadership feat loses a fair number of followers to an evil band of mercenaries, hired by an enemy church. The Paladin himself wasn't there for the battle and is feeling more than a little guilty and (as his God is also the God of retribution) more than a little angry. The men served him as well as the Church, so he defined this as a crime against the Church.

As the Bandit Kingdom doesn't have a court of law to appeal to, the Paladin decided to go there and hire them (not in disguise, per se, but not in his more obvious garb either). Once he established who the mercenaries who had actually served at the battle were

"I have heard some of you here fought at the Battle of the Crystal Spire. I am looking for exactly this type of battle-hardened men. If you were among them, tell me now..." Cast in a Zone of Truth helped.

The job interview consisted of the Paladin challenging the lot of them to one-on-one combat in his tent (under the cover of Silence spells). It was not exactly a close fight and he didn't expect it to be. Right thing to do or butchering those less powerful than he?

 

[mikebr99]

What stopped everyone, except the first picked to die, from crawling under the tent wall and escaping... and raising the alarm... and bringing the whole bandit kingdom down on the Paladin?

 

[Jeremy]

They all lined up outside of course and none of them found it strange that people went in and didn't come out.

Duh!

 

[mikebr99]

They all lined up outside of course and none of them found it strange that people went in and didn't come out.

Duh!

hey Jeremy... wasn't that in a movie?? History of the World Pt. 1??? or something??

 

[Jeremy]

Heh. Maybe, but I haven't seen that particular movie yet so I couldn't tell you.

 

[Ridley's Cohort]

The job interview consisted of the Paladin challenging the lot of them to one-on-one combat in his tent (under the cover of Silence spells). It was not exactly a close fight and he didn't expect it to be. Right thing to do or butchering those less powerful than he?

It is not an evil act. Who says a fight has to be fair?

It may not be honorable to trick someone like that. I would give him the benefit of the doubt in this case because the church morality would demand blood for blood so his god would probably be pleased.

In my mind, his actions were neither Evil nor Good, neither Lawful nor Chaotic. Paladins are allowed to do those kinds of things for reason. Just one opinion.

 

[Artoomis]

He did a good job of identifying the bad guys, no problem there at all.

The only question, really, is in how he challenged them. It should have been very clear that they were being punished for their deeds.

As far as outlcassing them, well, he coudln't really know that for sure, could he? He easily could have lost one of those combats, and the player would have been out one paladin - lost to good role playing.

He probably should have found some way to bring them to justice before the church, rather than take the law in his own hands.

Alternately, he should have run his plans by church officals first, to get their blessings.

Be should have to do some sort of penance, to keep him in his place within the church hierarchy. This act pushes teh limits just atad, perhpas, but I'd not call it "evil" - a bit chaotic, perhaps, since he was taking the law into his own hands, but not evil.

 

[reapersaurus]

i just wanna know how this worked, in D&D combat.

how does he kill a bunch of people, one at a time... IN A TENT....without any one of them just turning tail and run.
Not to mention their shock when seeing stacks of dead bodies and blood in this tent.

How big was this tent??!

Morally, I don't see much of a problem with it.
Sounds like a pretty ingenius way to bring Justice to a land that has none.
And I've never agreed with the Paladin-as-church-lackey thing....

 

[Artoomis]

And I've never agreed with the Paladin-as-church-lackey thing....

It does not need to be that way, but the original post made it sound like that was a consideration in this case. (Enemies of the Church, etc.)

 

[Westwind]

Thanks for the quick replies....just to clarify a few things people have brought up:

The bandits were in a semi-mobile city of tents, so bringing a big tent and setting it up (under the pretense that you're there for a few weeks at least to put together an army) wasn't too difficult.

The Paladin in question isn't a church lakey so much as a fairly important leader in the church itself (he's high level and has Leadership, after all). He did see the death of his men as a crime against his church though.

It's not like he killed 200 bandits that were all hanging out in his tent, mind you. It was closer to 40 (I didn't want numbers to be a factor, since I don't think they add to or mitigate the moral question here). He staggered the "target" interviews with other, non-lethal interviews to make things look more convincing (Sorry, you're just not what I'm looking for today, soldier). Those with the 2nd edition Tome of Magic can look up how he got rid of the bodies (Disintergration Chamber, mostly used for vile relics and such actually. I can't remember the last time he actually brought in on the road with him, the thing weighs a ton). The entire point was not to have a line outside the tent so people would start asking questions like "Hey, where did Thak go?" As hiring and such is a day-to-day happening here, having a new tent in town (so to speak) isn't something the entire place would queue up over.

The combat itself took place in an illusionary arena (2 men enter, 1 man leaves), so as to keep the mercs from running out/through/under the tent to escape. Side note: We had an interesting discussion if one could make an illusionary sound, the roar of the crowd in this case, in a silenced area....more a style question here, so it wasn't too important, but I voted yes. Anyone disagree?

And, when it was all said and done, he air walked home (alas, minus the tent and donkeys)

The entire thing was planned out the week previous to the playing session, down to a scale drawing of the tent--complete with cul-de-sac of chests and armors at the interview point--and various wording for the Zone of Truth talk and how other members of the party would play their roles, so please don't think it was some haphazard attack on the Bandit Kingdom (There are party members who might do that, please don`t give them ideas)

And yes, the DM decided to get crafty and threw in some veteran troops to make the day more difficult for the Paladin. This is where the entire staggering of the fights came in handy, since he had a decent chance to heal and such before summoning the next person to talk to.

But enough details, I was curious as to the alignment repercussions (or lack thereof).

And if this strikes you as nasty, just wait til he goes after the Church who hired these guys....