Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Next
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
Twitch
YouTube
Facebook (EN Publishing)
Facebook (EN World)
Twitter
Instagram
TikTok
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
You Cant Fix The Class Imbalances IMHO
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="Tony Vargas" data-source="post: 9172938" data-attributes="member: 996"><p>High level play being less functional isn't quite the same as removing it, but, yes, point taken...</p><p></p><p>Nod. My experiences through the edition war do contribute to my perception that way. It might be that a different, but still effective form of balance could have appealed, or at least, not inspired such profound rejection - I never saw one identified, however hypothetically, FWIW.</p><p></p><p>It's important to note that I'm not evaluating 5e for balance because I've defended 4e, just like I'm not finding fault with the 5e fighter because I've talked up the design of the 3.0 fighter or finding fault with 5e neo-Vancian because I liked playing magic-users and druids under traditional Vancian back in the day.</p><p>Rather, I found that, while several editions of D&D have tried to deliver class balance in a variety of ways, 4e has come closest. There are many other ways to achieve balance, other games that do so, but they'd likely be even less 'really D&D' than 4e was.</p><p>One possible alternative that occurred to me back in late 3.5 days, would have been to design all classes as single-level building blocks, like the 3e fighter, but more so. At the time, I thought "make everyone a fighter in the next D&D" was a non-starter, and that it wasn't really possible to balance classes in D&D, nor encounters except by DM talent/experience/illusionism. 4e proved me wrong. So I'm quite open seeing a very different form of balance than the one 4e tried working, presumably in some other game, since balance does not seem to be an option in D&D going forward.</p><p></p><p>Unplayable or/and unbalanced level ranges still consume resources and design space, just for little if any utility.</p><p></p><p>It often seems like D&D is aiming to work only in its sweet spot, because 'people don't play to high level,' which, if I'm following, leads you to conclude "why not just have a 1-10 game?"</p><p></p><p>That doesn't sound unreasonable.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Tony Vargas, post: 9172938, member: 996"] High level play being less functional isn't quite the same as removing it, but, yes, point taken... Nod. My experiences through the edition war do contribute to my perception that way. It might be that a different, but still effective form of balance could have appealed, or at least, not inspired such profound rejection - I never saw one identified, however hypothetically, FWIW. It's important to note that I'm not evaluating 5e for balance because I've defended 4e, just like I'm not finding fault with the 5e fighter because I've talked up the design of the 3.0 fighter or finding fault with 5e neo-Vancian because I liked playing magic-users and druids under traditional Vancian back in the day. Rather, I found that, while several editions of D&D have tried to deliver class balance in a variety of ways, 4e has come closest. There are many other ways to achieve balance, other games that do so, but they'd likely be even less 'really D&D' than 4e was. One possible alternative that occurred to me back in late 3.5 days, would have been to design all classes as single-level building blocks, like the 3e fighter, but more so. At the time, I thought "make everyone a fighter in the next D&D" was a non-starter, and that it wasn't really possible to balance classes in D&D, nor encounters except by DM talent/experience/illusionism. 4e proved me wrong. So I'm quite open seeing a very different form of balance than the one 4e tried working, presumably in some other game, since balance does not seem to be an option in D&D going forward. Unplayable or/and unbalanced level ranges still consume resources and design space, just for little if any utility. It often seems like D&D is aiming to work only in its sweet spot, because 'people don't play to high level,' which, if I'm following, leads you to conclude "why not just have a 1-10 game?" That doesn't sound unreasonable. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
You Cant Fix The Class Imbalances IMHO
Top