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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Hawken" data-source="post: 4268314" data-attributes="member: 23619">To further explain myself, I'll respond without quoting everything cwhs01 wrote:--Invisibility: Never had to be "sustained" in any previous edition. Doing so now doesn't add to the game, make it neater, more streamlined or whatever. It just nerfs a good combat/utility spell. Now its a level 6 "power" and it takes a standard action to sustain. Improved Invisibility sustains with a minor and that's 16th level--and it still ends when the invis person attacks so its not as Improved as 2e and 3e Improved.--Power Attack: And? And no more getting to calculate how much BAB to trade off for damage. And in a game where a "4th level" dragon has more HP than a party of 10th level characters (as an example), being able to do that extra damage can come in pretty handy!--Damage on a miss: Nope, actual misses. Whiff...bam! Plenty of examples.--No Monks: This is a problem, not exclusive to Monks but including all other "core" classes not included; barbarian, bard, sorcerer, etc.. And its a problem precisely because they are NOT there. The choice is not there. --Spells/Rituals: These are powers. Spells stopped being spells when they stopped "casting" them. Now they just happen. No chance of disruption, no more casting defensively. And at will Magic Missiles (just one example) is now a power, it also stopped being a spell when you can do it an unlimited number of times per day--at 1st level! --Everyone...powers: To sloppily quote from the Incredibles, "If everyone is special, then no one is." Call it exploits, or spells, if that makes you happy, whatever you need to try and bring a fantasy (not superhero) feel back to the game, but they went in the wrong direction with this stuff. Everyone can, more or less, do about the same thing, there's just a different power source labeled to it and slightly different fluff. --Dwarves: Actually, its against Large and bigger enemies. And for 3 previous editions its been +4 to AC and they didn't have to spend a feat to get it. If you were a Dwarf, a Giant had to work at squashing you. Now, the Dwarf has to take a feat to get a bonus that doesn't even come close to mitigating a Giant's attack bonus. While not "sacred cow" material, it is classic. Its just Dodge for Dwarves, and that isn't even around anymore.--Wizards: Say what? Why is it bad that WIZARDS are not the masters of the arcane anymore? Why is it bad their spells suck? Why would someone want to become a wizard just to get sucky spells? The point of Wizards is cool spells--getting to do what no one, or relatively few, other people can do. Not getting to do what the Fighter and Ranger can do, but having to wear a dress while doing it. Extending this to all classes, there is no compelling reason anymore to play one class over another. They all basically do about the same amount of damage at just about every level and have virtually no differences outside of combat beyond what they can wear. It just depends on whether you want to do that damage by weapon or some kind of energy. Sure, Wizards can Fly for...1 round, but a Fighter can drink a potion and doesn't need to be 16th or 19th level do to it! Despite the semi-sarcastic tone, there is no bitterness here, instead it is immense disappointment. I've played D&D through all its editions, having started off with my first red and blue boxes when I was seven or eight and this is the first time I've been disappointed with the game. This doesn't have the FEEL of D&D. Instead I find myself looking for the slot on my books for the quarters to go into. One more thing: Group play. This edition is designed for a group and a group of different classes. 3e went that way, but with tweaking only on the monsters the DM threw at you, it could easily be played solo. 1e and 2e had no such thing as this almost mandatory group design. You could play solo or in a group. You could play in a group of dwarf fighters, whatever, and you wouldn't be at any great disadvantage over a group of mixed races and classes. Here its designed for practically one of each race and class in a group, and you can't solo unless its considerably weaker monsters. Any 3e character, same race/class, is much more powerful in combat than a 4e character. Allowing for 4e 30 levels supposed to be the same scale as 3e 20 levels too. You put a 6th level 3e fighter against a 9th level 4e fighter and that 3e will out damage and out fight him! 4e is pretty much a watered down version of D&D. A Junior edition if you will! "Here kid, play this 4e until you're ready to step up to the major leagues and play 1e or 2e or 3e!" Ha! "You think your snazzy 21st level 4e Magic Missile is something doing 4d6 damage? Wait til you see all the dice you gotta roll for your Grandpa's 21st level 1e Magic Missile! Now THAT is a Magic Missile!"</blockquote>

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