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<blockquote data-quote="SnowleopardVK" data-source="post: 5895289" data-attributes="member: 6677945"><p>She likely wouldn't have let them get away entirely, but running just far enough back to claim a chokepoint (like the doorway that was one move action away from them) would allow them the clear advantage of having their melee fighter in the door with the casters behind him so that the casters couldn't all get picked off first. There were better tactics they could have gone with than a head-on attack when they were weakened.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>That's a bit harsh... I didn't use the words "suck it up" at any point, I just feel that they took the loss worse than they should have. Anyways, from their conversation afterwards (what I've heard since posting this topic) they seem to have decided this result was their fault and that they made poor decisions in an encounter that they should have been able to handle. They're still mad at me, though apparently they don't believe I gave them an unfair encounter.</p><p></p><p>I can only assume from that that they had assumed TPKs don't happen. I thought I'd made it clear to them that I have had TPKs in the past with my other group, but perhaps they assumed that I'd treat their group differently. Not sure.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>True. I usually trust these modules to be fairly well done, because they usually are, and following things as-written generally leads to fun encounters and situations. This was an exception, and unfortunately not one that I anticipated ahead of time or caught in my playtesting. So yes, I probably could have done better by not running the encounter as written, but I also think the bad reactions of the players was an issue.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Yup. Expanding on that, and continuing on what I said above, I'd say it's also important for a DM to be able to recognize when a module needs adjusting at all, which is something I apparently need to work on a bit. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>In many situations it is a very good idea, hence why they often do it. In this situation I knew it would go badly for them though, which is why I tried to avoid a situation where they could try it. </p><p></p><p>Also, in the "the whole group is going to attack you "situation it does make a slight difference who isn't attacking. Fighting enemies one at a time, or in waves is easier in most cases than fighting the same number of enemies all at once. Provoking those who aren't attacking into joining the fight makes the fight slightly harder than it would be if they join after you defeat the others.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="SnowleopardVK, post: 5895289, member: 6677945"] She likely wouldn't have let them get away entirely, but running just far enough back to claim a chokepoint (like the doorway that was one move action away from them) would allow them the clear advantage of having their melee fighter in the door with the casters behind him so that the casters couldn't all get picked off first. There were better tactics they could have gone with than a head-on attack when they were weakened. That's a bit harsh... I didn't use the words "suck it up" at any point, I just feel that they took the loss worse than they should have. Anyways, from their conversation afterwards (what I've heard since posting this topic) they seem to have decided this result was their fault and that they made poor decisions in an encounter that they should have been able to handle. They're still mad at me, though apparently they don't believe I gave them an unfair encounter. I can only assume from that that they had assumed TPKs don't happen. I thought I'd made it clear to them that I have had TPKs in the past with my other group, but perhaps they assumed that I'd treat their group differently. Not sure. True. I usually trust these modules to be fairly well done, because they usually are, and following things as-written generally leads to fun encounters and situations. This was an exception, and unfortunately not one that I anticipated ahead of time or caught in my playtesting. So yes, I probably could have done better by not running the encounter as written, but I also think the bad reactions of the players was an issue. Yup. Expanding on that, and continuing on what I said above, I'd say it's also important for a DM to be able to recognize when a module needs adjusting at all, which is something I apparently need to work on a bit. In many situations it is a very good idea, hence why they often do it. In this situation I knew it would go badly for them though, which is why I tried to avoid a situation where they could try it. Also, in the "the whole group is going to attack you "situation it does make a slight difference who isn't attacking. Fighting enemies one at a time, or in waves is easier in most cases than fighting the same number of enemies all at once. Provoking those who aren't attacking into joining the fight makes the fight slightly harder than it would be if they join after you defeat the others. [/QUOTE]
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