Off To War... Recriutment/Discussion

[Deskjob]

Blade Saint

Wow...

Choose any weapon and get; Extra hits, extra attack, extra damage, extra AC, ignore-prerequisite feats, 3High Save, and Monk abilities.

Fight like a Fighter, evade like a Rogue, saves like a Monk, speed like a Barbarian, skills like a Ranger, dogma like a Paladin, and Abundant-Step like a wizard...

Haha, did I miss anybody? Haha, I love ya wysiwyg!!! You're the freakin' man.

 

[Deskjob]

How to design a Custom Class... Deskjob style.

Old friend taught me this.

Step 1: take an NPC class. (not a PC class)
Step 2: take a new concept.
Step 3: add to the NPC class; feats, features, magic, etc.
Step 4: make it complete
Step 5: make it under-powered
Step 6: let your DM review it.
Step 7: let your DM increase its power until balanced.

(optional) Step 8: Tell your group that your class will pawn their class. Because they are noobs. Watch them commit seppuku in shame.

 

[HolyMan]

I thought of something to play. This is a variant of the monk class that uses one weapon (and one weapon only) to specialize in, instead of unarmed strikes. He loses all of his weapon proficiencies besides for one (of his choice). He gains light armor instead (that can be used in conjunction with AC bonuses). There are a few changes. see the attachment.

I have already included our +2 skill points to the class skills. Otherwise minor wordings have been changed, usually the words "unarmed strike" have been replaced by just plain "strike".

Feedback?

Going over Blade Saint I have a ton of comments but maybe this will help alittle more... Remember when you are doing this you have to taylor the class but still leave it open to progress in different directions someone should be able to take your class and taylor it to what they would like to play in that same style.. Why wouldn't a trained swordsman use med armor or a shield? switching the alignment to Any>? Someone who strives for perfection in a field/art can't be CN,CG, lawful is the means to follow a code or way of life not just the laws in general a LE charcter warps laws to suit them and only follows them when he must(and he must follow the way of the blade saint or not become one with his chosen weapon) whta else?? skills why does a weapon master have move silently?/ thats used to sneak away fom combat and to this class combat is the only way to aspire

I LOVE!LOVE! FLURRY OF STRIKES- (+20XP) great concept moving his blade so fast they can't defend themselves, react to the BS and this brings up my last point--- The Man and The Weapon this concept is a good one and you should have it figured out that at lvl 20 somehow they are one but the man without the weapon is what still gets AC bonus, special abilities?? I would say every ability is based around his weapon and without it in his hands he is defenseless and normal i.e. stilll mind a wizard starts to cast an enchantment on the BS he looks to his sword for support gaining confiedence that if this weapon gets in range that wizard is dead hence the sword gives th +2 bonus if its on the floor in another room why would he have a +2 bonus monks train to perfect themselves it s why so much "body" features:

I'm rambling but I have always loved the Kensai type characters lets work on this from the needs weapon perspective a little see what we come up with?

Little help everybody-- thanks ahead of time.

 

[HolyMan]

HolyMan if you are allowing such drastic changes to base classes why not allow other sources? I want to play a fighter/mage but going Wizard-Eldritch Knight is not the best choice. If you allow Complete Arcane, Complete Mage, Complete Warrior, Unearthed Arcana etc. i could pick better classes.

Not using the books completely post the class you want for review but try to limit the books i would need to study on the class/feats/abilities

As you my notice i did allow the variant Battle Sorcerer

 

[HolyMan]

Wow...

Choose any weapon and get; Extra hits, extra attack, extra damage, extra AC, ignore-prerequisite feats, 3High Save, and Monk abilities.

Fight like a Fighter, evade like a Rogue, saves like a Monk, speed like a Barbarian, skills like a Ranger, dogma like a Paladin, and Abundant-Step like a wizard...

Haha, did I miss anybody? Haha, I love ya wysiwyg!!! You're the freakin' man.

You gave it alot of PROS no CONS???

 

[HolyMan]

Still haven't gotten a good name for the class, but here's what I've got so far:
(Still no name for it yet)[Base Class Monk]
Swapping Concentration for Bluff, Knowledge: Arcana for Intimidate, Knowledge: Religion for diplomacy

Swapping Still Mind for another 2/2 feat (I'd just say a feat... but still mind really is weak, but since this class isn't based too much around mystical training, resistance to enchantments didn't make much sense)

Swapping Diamond Soul for a Bonus feat (Again, spell resistance doesn't make a ton of sense for a mundane combatant)

Swapping Empty Body for a bonus feat (Becoming ethereal... again... doesn't fit a showfighter without mystical training)

Swapping Ki Strike: Lawful for a bonus feat (This class has no alignment leaning, really.)

One thing I was hoping to change to suit better, was to key this classes AC bonus on Charisma instead of Wisdom(and hopefully stunning fist uses too), the reasoning being that this is more of a 'streetwise' character than one who has learned higher wisdom and such.

Trade Proficiency with Shuriken to proficency with Shortbows(Bows would likely be more useful(than crossbows) for hunting any sort of creature that may steal the families chickens or whatnot, and most farmer's don't see shurikens that much...)

Trade Proficiency with Siangham and nun-chucks for profiency with a great axe (Farmer boy cutting up wood for the family)

Trade proficiency with heavy crossbow and sai for Spiked Chain proficiency(Learned due to it's rarity making it more impressive to wield effectively).

I suppose this sounds like a lot of changes, but I tried to keep it more towards a more mundane(magicwise) theme and such.

Opinions?

Name for the class can't help you I'm drawing a blank sorry. I'm glad everyone is using the monk as a base class makes it so much easier when you go over the same abilities This is D&D you can explain anything away when your the DM just watch- A babies cry could be heard out in the other room, and the woman sitting in it sighed and started to rise. Suddenly the crying stopped and the old farmwife smiled and settled back down in her chair. "Cried himself back to sleep." she says slowly drifting off herself. In the babies room the Whillorn pixies take to the air again, Skultle returns from the other room a huge smile going from one huge ear to the other. He floats up to the group hovering above the babies crib, a little sleeping dust trailing from him still. "Outs!, Outs! Mes' made her outs!" he cries. "Shh!," "Shh!," Comes from some of the others, as the look down at the baby. Skultle looks at the little human baby as it stares back up at the pixies flying over him. "This the one?, the one?" he asks skeptical. Just then the room begins to glow the shining coming from the air itself as to drive back the darkness from the beautiful Pixie Queen that flys to join the others. "Yes, Skultle he is the one. The one who will oneday save us and his own race. We must help protect him he has a long hard road ahead." "But he cants walk!, cants walk!," Skultle answers. The Pixie Queen just smiles, "Come, Skultle come everyone we have alot to do this night." The magic that was worked that night was said to be the greatest in the history of the pixie world, they had set out to make a champion of two peoples and stop an acient evil soon to awake.

Sorry guys been writing for the first IC post and getting carried away the point is anything can be explianed in D&D. So far your swaps are o.k. but try to make more generic like instead of spiked chain just say the get an exotic weapon feat remember someone else wants to play this class the might not want to be limited to one weapon. Great axe hmmm ok was going to say battle axe but you chop would with two hands so ok. Charisma is a better base for performing in the circle using intimidate, and gaing prestige and fame as a prize fighter so ok again. lawful did u see my post on alignment to wysiwyg if you follow a cod/disipline then lawful is the way you make this character then choose a chaotic alignment and you may have a conflict-- like with the rules for prize fighting.

 

[shorty]

review my character please

Name: Linky
User: josh
Class: Fighter
Level: 1
Race: Human
Alignment: CN
Deity: Kord
Size: 6ft
Age: 24
Gender: Male
Weight: 120
Eye: Light Blue
Hair: Brown
Skin: White

Stats:
Str: 16 (3)
Dex: 14 (2)
Con: 16 (3)
Int: 13 (1)
Wis: 13 (1)
Cha: 11 (0)

HP: 16
AC: 20

Initiative: (2)

Saving Throws:
Fortitude: (5)
Reflex: (2)
Will: (2)

Base Attack Bonus: (1)

Grapple: (4)

Skills:
Climb (4)
Concentration (4)
Craft - Sword (2)
Gather Information (3)
Handle Animal (1)
Intimidate (1)
Jump (4)
Listen (2)
Ride (3)
Search (4)
Spot (2)
Swim (4)

Feats:
Toughness +3 HP
Power Attack
Clev
Investigator +2/+2 Gather Information/Search

Languages:
Common
Elvin
Gnomish

Items:
Back Pack
Bed roll
50 ft. rope
Water skin
4 day trail ration
x2 torch
x1 cure light potion

Armor:
Brest Plate, Medium armor, (5) AC (3) Dex

Shield:
Large Steel Shield (2) AC

Weapon:
Long Sword (4) 1D8 19-20/x2

Money
gp: 150

 

[wysiwyg]

Right, time for feedback.
What I basically did was create a new type of monk who does not specialize in hand-to-hand combat but rather in one specific weapon instead. I cut and pasted the monk, and edited text relating to unarmed combat. I did have the kensai concept in mind, but I didn't want to call him a kensai because of the oriental image. I have a kind of Achilles (aka Brad Pitt) from the Troy movie in mind.
Now let’s start with the give and takes, i.e. the changes between my "kensai" and the monk:

Alignment: Should be lawful - I agree. I think it was a typo. I think...

Weapons: Lose all but one weapon of the PC's choice. Gain the choice for the weapon to be any weapon however.

Armor: Gain light armor and shields (btw, shields should be in). In light of the restrictions of weapons, I decided to allow him to be proficient in armor instead. The reason I did not give him medium and heavy armor is due to the fact that he is a very mobile-tactile combatant who cannot be hindered by armor (just like the monk). Again, this is compromise because of his lack of weapon selection.

Skills: Knowledge (arcana/religion) swapped to Knowledge (local/history). The arcana/religion I feel is based on the oriental monk. I don't know why TSR decided that you can have elvish monks and they have to be modelled after the Japanese. As far as game balance is concerned, nothing is affected. As far as image, a lot is eliminated.

Abilties:
Flurry of strikes replaces flurry of blows (change in name only)
Improved Strike replaces Unarmed damage. A weapon already has its own damage dice and doesn't really change. Whereas the monk's damage does. I had two options: (a) Make the damage of the weapon change to be the same as the monk's current unarmed strike, or (b) keep the weapon damage dice the same but increase the damage dealt as the PC progresses. Option (b) made more sense to me. So I gave him a much lower damage bonus (a 20th level monk gets 2d10 for his strikes, whereas my class only has +5 for my option. But to compensate, I gave him pluses to his attack roll. If anyone prefers, I could always just go back to option (a) instead.

Now, to respond to all the queries:

Wow...Choose any weapon and get; Extra hits, extra attack, extra damage, extra AC, ignore-prerequisite feats, 3High Save, and Monk abilities.

Fight like a Fighter, evade like a Rogue, saves like a Monk, speed like a Barbarian, skills like a Ranger, dogma like a Paladin, and Abundant-Step like a wizard...

Haha, did I miss anybody? Haha, I love ya wysiwyg!!! You're the freakin' man.

I almost all of the above is really muted if you compare him to a monk
Extra hits - There are no extra hits,
extra attack - no extra attacks,
extra damage - no extra damage (in fact quite the opposite is true),
extra AC - that's true (compromise for his lack of weapon choices)
ignore prerequisite feats, 3High Save, and Monk abilities - Exactly because they are all monk abilities, and he is a variant monk.
Fight like a Fighter, evade like a Rogue, saves like a Monk, speed like a Barbarian, skills like a Ranger, dogma like a Paladin, and Abundant-Step like a wizard... - Again, you could say the same for a normal monk...

(Q) Why wouldn't a trained swordsman use med armor or a shield?
(A) A trained swordsman would. One who needs to be more mobile in combat would not. BTW, I could just take out the monk’s AC bonus and allow him to wear armor instead (both medium and heavy).

(Q) Why does a weapon master have move silently? That’s used to sneak away from combat, and to this class combat is the only way to aspire.
(A) I have never seen a rogue using Move silently to run away from combat. You need hide in plain sight for that. This skill is mostly used to get a good position of your enemy for a first strike. We could tailor the skills to be different than the monk (the Kensai class in Complete Warrior come to mind). I just wanted to do as few changes as possible. How about the following skills instead: Balance (Dex), Climb (Str), Concentration (Con), Craft (Int), Diplomacy (Cha), Jump (Str), Heal (Wis), Intimidate (Cha), Knowledge (history/local/geography) (Int), Listen (Wis), Perform (Cha), Profession (Wis), Ride (Dex), Sense Motive (Wis), Spot (Wis), Swim (Str), Survival (Wis), and Tumble (Dex).

(Q) The Man and The Weapon this concept is a good one and you should have it figured out that at level 20 somehow they are one; but the man without the weapon is what: still gets AC bonus, special abilities? I would say every ability is based around his weapon and without it in his hands he is defenceless and normal i.e. still mind a wizard starts to cast an enchantment on the BS he looks to his sword for support gaining confidence that if this weapon gets in range that wizard is dead hence the sword gives the +2 bonus if it’s on the floor in another room why would he have a +2 bonus monks train to perfect themselves it’s why so much "body" features:
(A) I hear it. The downside to what you are saying is that he is nothing without his weapon. A lot of the class abilities are not related to the weapon but rather to the way the character perfected himself (without it). Can he no longer ride a horse as well, or tumble or spot? Is his BAB/saves/HP any different? Of course not. He does not sleep and shower with his sword. He’s desire is to become the most competent warrior with his type of weapon (just as the monk is the ultimate unarmed combatant). There is no reason to penalize him. To so drastically limits the class; how would you compensate for it?




More feedback please...

BTW, speaking about bonus XP. I would like to give XP penalties for bed spelin! Your spelling make my eyes water. Please, for the love of everything that’s holy, please, please, please x200, use a spelling checker.

Now let e go over all the other posts, one by misspelled one...

 

[Deskjob]

Blade Saint

Yeah, your right. Monks are just cool like that. Why not a variant monk too right? Makes sense.

Last thing though. Why the improving attack and damage every 5 levels? Can't you just enchant your weapon like the rest of us? Monks can't enchant their fists so they get a damage bonus, right? Or were we hoping for both; for a +10/+10/+Ki at lv20?

"Wow, you just crit... So,.. I think he exploded?... into outer space."

 

[Walking Dad]

Co-DM...is that like a 3-star general? Thanks for the promotion. I am only intending to be a secondary arbitrator/advisor, nothing more though.

I have attached the Tamor Hunter as it stands now in a neat format. I still feel that the class is unbalanced, but if you feel that it's not an issue, than it's not - this is your game after all.

Some points to consider about the class:

I think there are too many bonus feats that were given at first level (he has 5!). There is no reason to give him so many. The ranger only had 3 abilities at this level. I think weapon focus & skill focus (intimidate) are redunctant extras that he can pay from his normal 1st level feats.

Also, I noticed that intimidation is something built into the class, even though it's not in the ranger's class skill list. I added intimidation at the cost of: ride, swim (it's a mountainous region that they come from) & handle animal (since mountainous people usually do not have much livestock to look after - unless they look after tamors ).

Is there a reason he needs the monk's AC bonus? The monk has it because of his kung-fu training - I doubt the T/H have that kind of skill. Why can just they not wear light armor instead?

Favourite enemy must, I repeat must stay: The tamor's themselves! The whole class is named after this creature, for heaven's sake!! It might be that it's not the greatest class ability, but that's no reason to discard it, especially for the TAMOR HUNTERS.

Let me know how you feel, and whether I should redraft the attachment.

On a different note: I am actually in the process of immigrating. I am leaving SA on the 4th of July. I am hoping to have a phone line up and running sometimes between 7th-10th July. Instead of having a hiccup in my playing session, my PC (that I have not yet thought of) should maybe only be introduced after I am settled in. This way we won't have our first AWOL before the game even started.

Ok, I'm perhaps out. My initial concept was a 3300-Spartan like character. Not an apache with some of my most disliked abilities (I don't like to specific (not weak!) abilities: favored enemy, terrain, ... and extra characters class features (familiar, companion) ... heck, most is in the ranger class.)

Last straw: monk as base. Only 'monk weapons' spear, shield, slashing shortsword (stats like cutlass), unarmed. All weapons used by a monk do monk unarmed damage (only type (bludgeoning, piercing, slashing...) changes). AC feature allows for med load and shields, but looses static bonus for monk levels. Close to the base class enough?