D&D 5E Is 5th Edition Directly Descended from Star Wars Saga Edition?

Just watching something on FoolTube: a review of Star Wars (saga edition). And it has some interesting features:

• "A complete overhaul of the d20 system"
• A lump-sum "trained" bonus to skills
• Runs "quickly" and "clean"
• Villains included in the player's handbook
• Defenses redesigned
• Condensed skills list, can be used untrained

Which reminds me of some 5th ed. features:

• "Proficiency" bonus is a lump bonus to skills
• PH includes tieflings, dragonborn, and sith lords
• Threw out Fortitude, Reflex, and Will (versus AC)
• Lots of scaling with level, based on proficiency

Perhaps most telling:



and

Mhhmhmhmhm...

Silly, you sound! Sooo Different, they are!

More like, Saga Edition combined parts of 3e and 4e, then 4e is descended from Saga Edition, and parts of 5e are descended from 4e, which in some mechanics returned to earlier editions' way of handling some things. So 5E could in some ways be called "2.9 + 4.1 -2" Edition. I'm sure a math hobbyist could come up with a much more complex algebraic looking formula that more accurately details how much of each edition is included but still adds up to 5 as a joke, but I'm not that person.

Saga was one of the bridges to 4ed and most of the similarity between it an 5ed are also in 4ed. (except for maybe the fast play pert.) Though when you get down to it, 5ed is a big mix that means a lot of people see their thing in it.

No not really although it was an influence on 4E. A D&D Saga edition should have been made in 2008 IMHO but we got 4E instead. I think a tweaked Saga system would be the best d20 game WoTC could make.

I can definitely see some similarities. Saga Edition used a lot of rerolls, and one of the best features you could get as a racial bonus or feat was "roll twice, keep the higher roll." I think it's quite possible that was the germ of the advantage/disadvantage mechanic.

But Saga Edition is definitely crunchier than 5E overall.

One thing i lovedlovedloved about Saga Edition was the condition track instead of different conditions for sickened, nauseated, dazed, off-balanced, out of shampoo, etc. instead, a debilitating effect took you to -1, -2, -5, -10, then unconscious, so they stacked up instead of each being a discrete effect.

jayoungr said:

I can definitely see some similarities. Saga Edition used a lot of rerolls, and one of the best features you could get as a racial bonus or feat was "roll twice, keep the higher roll." I think it's quite possible that was the germ of the advantage/disadvantage mechanic.

But Saga Edition is definitely crunchier than 5E overall.

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2E had spells that granted disadvantage and there was a optional roll 3 dice take the best rule as well..

The condition track looks to be the only thing that really came from SAGA edition. It looks to be more difficult to abuse in 5th edition though.

Zardnaar said:

I think a tweaked Saga system would be the best d20 game WoTC could make.

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Here's something I never thought I would say: 5e is better than SWSE.

IMO, of course, and YMMV.

This got me thinking...

I wonder how well a "5e" version of Saga would work?

One of the biggest problems with Saga was that everything scaled wildly different (skills were super high and slowly grew, defenses steadily grew, and attacks varied on class) which resulted in a small "sweet spot" around mid-level where all the numbers converged, and widely unbalanced beginnings (Where Skills dominated defenses, making the Force an auto-win) and ends (by high level, your defenses were so good using the Force was useless). 5e's singular "proficiency bonus" to attacks, saves, skills, and (in this game, to compensate armor) AC would be a good fix to the math.

Additionally, subclasses would be a good way to introduce archetypes (Jedi Guardian, Consular), Hit Dice (with the Healing surge variant) is a good Second Wind mechanic, the game is balanced against not needing magic items, and I'm sure a decent Force mechanic could be hammered out of Saga's encounter-card system and 5e's pseudo-Vancian magic. Oh, and Backgrounds would be great for distinguishing pilots, bounty hunters, farmboys and rebel princesses.

Heck, the Fighter could Straight Up be used for Solider, the Rogue is probably not far off of Scoundrel. Bard and Ranger (reworked to avoid spells) would be Nobles and Scout bases, and Jedi seems like a good Paladin/Eldritch Knight hack. It'd take some work, but I'm sure it could be done.