Are monsters with legendary and or lair actions supposed to be boss monsters/

[jayoungr]

Solo monsters can work in 5E. I gave a melee-heavy level 19 party fits with an ancient wind dragon in its lair from the Tome of Beasts. But minions definitely make the fight easier to tweak and reduce the chance of the party steamrolling the boss.

 

[FrogReaver]

Yup. Solo monsters work great if the party has dealt with the monsters minions or lair before hand. If the heroes plough through the lair/minions, get to the door of the bosses lair... and then rest... well... that’s a failure on the part of the DM.

It’s hard to push players into risking their characters lives to be heroes when they don’t want to.

 

[cmad1977]

It’s hard to push players into risking their characters lives to be heroes when they don’t want to.

If the characters aren’t willing to risk their lives to defeat the solo/boss monster wreaking havoc upon the land... then I’ve done a poor job of motivating them.

 

[FrogReaver]

If the characters aren’t willing to risk their lives to defeat the solo/boss monster wreaking havoc upon the land... then I’ve done a poor job of motivating them.

Not really. You can’t control the players or their characters. That you think you can no matter doesn’t make sense

 

[Rossbert]

I find it is not that hard to not give them time if they camp too close they either get ambushed or the target flees during the rest, if they camp far away new beasties notice the now empty residences of the just cleared monsters and move in.

 

[Dausuul]

Just curious, for folks saying "solo monsters don't work*"--what exactly do you mean by this? In my experience, there are three ways in which a solo monster can fail to work:

• It dies too quickly, because it doesn't have enough hit points and/or LR. I feel that this is on the DM to manage: If you know that your players are skilled tacticians/optimizers, you should expect to have to beef up a boss monster's defenses. D&D's out of the box experience is, and should be, geared toward the casual player.
• The party has access to powerful combos or spells that can shut the monster down hard. I'm on the fence about whether this belongs in the DM's court or the designers'. DMs should be aware of the weapons their players bring to the table, but I feel that most high-level monsters should have answers to any single spell.
• The monster lacks answers to simple tactics available at low levels, like a flying PC with a +1 bow and a bag of holding**. This is absolutely a design failure. Tarrasque, I'm lookin' at you.

My experience is that the first issue is by far the most common. The second issue mostly starts to crop up once you get into double-digit levels, particularly at level 13 when forcecage becomes available. The third is limited to a handful of monsters.

[SIZE=-2]*If a solo monster doesn't work without minions, then it doesn't work, period. The point of a solo monster is to not need minions.

**The bag of holding is so you don't run out of arrows.[/SIZE]

 

[cmad1977]

Not really. You can’t control the players or their characters. That you think you can no matter doesn’t make sense

Never said control.

 

[robus]

[*]The monster lacks answers to simple tactics available at low levels, like a flying PC with a +1 bow and a bag of holding**. This is absolutely a design failure. Tarrasque, I'm lookin' at you.

I was with you until this... How does a low level PC with just a +1 bow easily defeat a tarrasque with AC 25? And what are the other PCs doing except being eaten by the tarrasque?

 

[Dausuul]

Not really. You can’t control the players or their characters. That you think you can no matter doesn’t make sense

You can control whether the boss monster opens the door and walks out. That and dispel magic are all you need to prevent the PCs from resting before a boss fight, unless they're quite high-level.

 

[Dausuul]

I was with you until this... How does a low level PC with just a +1 bow easily defeat a tarrasque with AC 25? And what are the other PCs doing except being eaten by the tarrasque?

The PC with the bow flies overhead shooting arrows, resupplying from the bag of holding. You may need a 20 to hit, you may only deal 1d8+1 damage, but the 5E tarrasque has no regeneration and no way to reach you in the air (normal longbow range is 150 feet, which puts you out of range of improvised weapons and Frightful Presence). You can grind it down, hour by hour, till it's dead.

The other PCs are far, far away.

Although... now that I think about it, you do have to have a way to keep up with the thing. With legendary movement, it can outrun you. So, I suppose it's not quite that easy.