D&D 5E Attack of the Clones: Simulacrum

[dave2008]

There's no such restriction.

First, Simulacrum #1 casts wish (duplicating simulacrum) on you to make Simulacrum #2 and orders it to obey your direct commands.

Because you have wish prepared and a 9th-level slot ready, Simulacrum #2 also has these things. It immediately uses wish to create Simulacrum #3, duplicating you again. Rinse and repeat.

If the DM allows simulacra to make more simulacra, your army can grow at a rate of one clone per round.

It is still only any "army" of seven, see my post one above yours. Again, unless I am missing something.

 

[mellored]

Extending that thought, a reason isn't technically required to invalidate the evil archmage clone army. NPCs and PCs just can't use simulacrum to create a clone army. Because if they could, then evil archmages could create an army of clones, and they'd already haven't they done so in the past. In which case, the current era could easily be dominated by clone armies. Presumably, there aren't clone armies in the far or recent past, so unless something changed, evil archmages in the current era can't either.

Your assuming anyone who has access to infinite wish spells would stay around. With simulacrums wishing for you, you avoid any downside like not being able to cast it again. So they could simply create their own demi-plane filled with infinite servants to do whatever they want.

Why conquer a world when you have the power to create your own and fill it with whatever luxury you want? (including ample snow and rubies).

 

[shadowoflameth]

If you cast sim of yourself (71hp. sim in this example), then you get a sim with one less 7th level slot. Then have the sim cast wish to make another sim of you. One without the 7th level slot or wish. Even if the sims both use their remaining 7th level slots to create more of you, each one is still down a slot from its creator until the sims don't have a spell to create another with. After a rest, you can create another, but each time you do, the one you previously created is destroyed. Granted the sims could together create a bunch but they are all illusions. If someone in play did this, even if they all somehow followed the players wishes, one well placed Dispel magic could destroy sims, and later ones would have no spells of 7th level or higher.

 

[Zardnaar]

If you cast sim of yourself (71hp. sim in this example), then you get a sim with one less 7th level slot. Then have the sim cast wish to make another sim of you. One without the 7th level slot or wish. Even if the sims both use their remaining 7th level slots to create more of you, each one is still down a slot from its creator until the sims don't have a spell to create another with. After a rest, you can create another, but each time you do, the one you previously created is destroyed. Granted the sims could together create a bunch but they are all illusions. If someone in play did this, even if they all somehow followed the players wishes, one well placed Dispel magic could destroy sims, and later ones would have no spells of 7th level or higher.

Well you can clone yourself, wait day get your spells back get your clone to clone you wash rinse repeat.

 

[shadowoflameth]

I the sim uses Wish, it no longer has it and neither does the sim it creates if you've used it. that means the sims would run out of 7th level slots creating more. It also means that after the sims created no longer had Wish, they would have to expend material cost to create more.

 

[Flamestrike]

If my players want to mess with creating a self recursive AI with access to reality altering magic, then they get everything they deserve.

Like... the singularity.

 

[Balfore]

Yes the simulacrum loop was noticed early on. Even without looping it you can create simulacrums and have them cast wish spells for you getting around the 33% chance of losing the spell.

As long as you are standing there to copy, correct?
Because they won't have a 9th level slot after YOU cast it from wish.

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk

 

[Zardnaar]

As long as you are standing there to copy, correct?
Because they won't have a 9th level slot after YOU cast it from wish.

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk

They only need a level 7 slot for simulacrum.

Day 1 you create a simulacrum via wish or simulacrum. You rest and get your spells back. You call your clone disposable 1.
Day 2 Disposable 1 clones you with all your spells back creating alpha 1,
Day 3 Alpha 1 clones you twice creating Alpha 3 and 4,
Day 4 alpha 3 and 4 clone you twice creating alpha 5-8,
Day 5 Alpha 5 to 8 clone you twice creating Alpha 9-16
Day 6 Alpha 9-16 clone you twice creating Alpha 17-32.
Day 7 64
Day 8 128
Day 9 256
Day 10 512
Day 11 1024
Day 12 2048
Day 13 4096

By day 6 you can have 32 wish spells available for the cost of 48 000 gp. By day 13 you can have 4096 although realistically you might run low on money after day 10.

What they should have done was have a line saying each being can only have 1 simulacrum at a time or you can only clone yourself and the clone has 50% of your levels (rounded down).

Can Wish create money? In previous editions IIRC you could create 25k or so with it.

Each clone even after they reproduce still has a level 8 spell slot, all of their level 1-6 spells and can spam 4d10 firebolts or whatever cantrip.

At level 20 the pattern is.
1
3
9
27
81
243
729 etc

If you cast simulacrum in the level 8 slot as well the level 20 pattern is now level 17 and the level 20 pattern is now.
1
4
16
64
512
2048

How much cash do you have and how many wish spells do you want? Send your clones out to raid low level dungeons, the caves of Chaos has around 40kgp in it.

 

[Balfore]

Anti magic shell... and walk right thru them all... POOF!

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk

 

[Balfore]

They only need a level 7 slot for simulacrum.

Day 1 you create a simulacrum via wish or simulacrum. You rest and get your spells back. You call your clone disposable 1.
Day 2 Disposable 1 clones you with all your spells back creating alpha 1,
Day 3 Alpha 1 clones you twice creating Alpha 3 and 4,
Day 4 alpha 3 and 4 clone you twice creating alpha 5-8,
Day 5 Alpha 5 to 8 clone you twice creating Alpha 9-16
Day 6 Alpha 9-16 clone you twice creating Alpha 17-32.
Day 7 64
Day 8 128
Day 9 256
Day 10 512
Day 11 1024
Day 12 2048
Day 13 4096

By day 6 you can have 32 wish spells available for the cost of 48 000 gp. By day 13 you can have 4096 although realistically you might run low on money after day 10.

What they should have done was have a line saying each being can only have 1 simulacrum at a time or you can only clone yourself and the clone has 50% of your levels (rounded down).

Can Wish create money? In previous editions IIRC you could create 25k or so with it.

Each clone even after they reproduce still has a level 8 spell slot, all of their level 1-6 spells and can spam 4d10 firebolts or whatever cantrip.

At level 20 the pattern is.
1
3
9
27
81
243
729 etc

If you cast simulacrum in the level 8 slot as well the level 20 pattern is now level 17 and the level 20 pattern is now.
1
4
16
64
512
2048

How much cash do you have and how many wish spells do you want? Send your clones out to raid low level dungeons, the caves of Chaos has around 40kgp in it.

When you say 'alpha 1 clones you twice' is that:
1 wish spell and 1 simulacrum spell?

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk