Can the DM drive roleplaying?

[HellHound]

Can the DM drive roleplaying?

I used to drive while roleplaying quite a bit. It was our fave way of passing the time between Ottawa and Picton.

But generally speaking, we found it a lot easier if one of the players is doing the driving so the DM has his or her hands free to peruse the books. Only in very rules-lite systems can the DM get away with doing the driving while roleplaying.

 

[DungeonmasterCal]

Having played in one 12 year long campaign and dm'd a 10 year long one where both were VERY roleplay intensive, I have to say it really boils down to a balance between the gm and the players, as well as another factor; frequency of play. Those 2 games, (which ran concurrently) saw us playing one or the other nearly every week. We felt an incentive to build the characters up, because we couldn't wait until the next session to slip into the role.

Now, my group gets to play very, very infrequently, and the incentive for deep immersion roleplaying isn't there. We gather to not just play, but to just hang out together. As a DM, I don't pressure anyone to deeply roleplay. If it comes about organically, that's the best. If the general method of play tends toward light roleplay, then that's what we go with. It's not a contest in order to win some statue of a shiny bald guy, it's to have fun. And fun comes in all flavors.

 

[EricNoah]

Having NPCs ask more questions, and more in-depth questions (something that requires a thoughtful answer like an opinion or a prediction, rather than yes/no or factual short answer), might get some interesting words to come out of the players' mouths.

 

[Celebrim]

Sure, it can be done.

A DM taught me how to role play by example, by nagging me to speak in character, and by rewarding me for doing so with small 'treats' of extra experience when I made him laugh with in appropriate character comments or otherwise contributed alot to the evening (a practice that I continue).

But as a DM that's been doing it a while, I got to say that the older and more set in their ways the player is, the harder its going to be to get them to break out of thier mold.

And I agree with Gothmog on this, the best way to do handle powergamers is take away thier rules and force them to deal with the environment in a different way. You may not have to take away thier character sheets, but write down what the character's saves, spot, search, and combat bonuses are for thier most common attacks on a handy pad at the beginning of the session. This makes secret checks easy, and it cuts down on cheating by misreporting the dice and/or their bonuses. Just as importantly though, it makes the game rules less thier responcibility and more yours. Don't let them spend most of thier time arguing about what bonuses they are supposed to receive and figuring up. Don't let them stall to work out what the best move is going to be. Never allow takebacks and dithering. If a player appears to be trying to stall, I go to a six count. If they can't act before 6, they lose thier turn. That alone stops alot of powergaming calculation. If necessary, change rule systems to something that they don't know and run a short series of adventures 'just for a change of pace'. Horror/Mystery games like Chill (if you could find it) are good for this because you've got an OOC excuse for why you don't want them reading the rule books.

You've also got to crack the whip a little to get them to stop phrasing everything in terms of the rules. This means not answering gamist questions in gamist terms. Try to not put rules in your own mouth unless you absolutely have to. Don't say, 'The orc takes a 5' step and makes an attack on Bob [the player]. Take 6 damage, Bob' Instead say, 'The orc darts to the party's left and with a howl delivers a slash at Haldor's midsection with his scimitar! HRroowllloop!!! He draws blood for 6 damage!' Yes, this can get tedious if you've got 15 Orcs involved in the battle round after round, but do like a good movie maker and just edit down to the important stuff. I've got about 12 different colored d20's which I can arrange in a linear spectrum from purple to red so that I always know that say the Orange one is #8 when I line them up. In mass combat, I roll the whole bunch, figure out how many hit and who, and will say something like, "The fierce melee continues with clanging steel BANG and alot of howling and screeching, but the Orc's bark is worse than thier bite. Only Haldor is worsted, when an blow catches him unexpectedly in the thigh and deals 9 damage." Be an efficient DM rules wise, so you can spend your time being an entertaining DM rather than flipping through pages and trying to work out how things work.

Oh, and the first thing I learned as a DM is that you can't be embrassed about roll playing. If you are hesistant and nervous about RPing, then you can't expect your players to get into it either. So go ahead, make a fool of yourself.

As a player, I get bored to death while some DM's I know go, "Ok, orc #1 attacks Bob. *clatter* It misses. Orc #2 attacks Jim *clatter* It misses., etc." If you make the player wait 2 minutes between his turns, you are never going to maintain tension and excitement.

Being dramatic in combat probably won't get alot of cinematic replies, because it can be tedious thinking up new ways to phrase things again and again, but if you are consistantly 'in character' whether in or out of combat, I think it makes for a better experience on the part of the players (just don't get caught up in your own wordiness), and is more likely to encourage them to respond in character when you aren't in combat.

Be in character all the time. Be entertaining. Vary your voice between NPC's.

Ultimately, none of this is going to work if the player's don't trust you to be fair as a DM.

Also, its entirely possible that you've grown as a DM beyond the group you are with and you are't doing anything wrong. I've had some very successful sessions where everyone in the group was anxious to get back next week except me, because I was bored to tears and tired of having NPC's talking to each other. Let me tell you, there is NOTHING worse as a DM than having to have NPC's make all the conversation because the PC's refuse to talk to each other or the NPC's. I miss my old group too, so I know where you are coming from.

That's enough spammage for now.

 

[Hijinks]

To be honest, most players that don't roleplay, in my experience of course (because if you don't type that, someone assumes you're trying to make vast stereotype comments), that the player doesnt' role play because he's just no good at it.

I'd have to disagree a bit. Perhaps if you refer this statement to *only* experienced gamers who have been doing it for years and years. I, personally, am just getting back into it and I'm still reluctant to roleplay because I'm self-conscious. Coming from an online gaming environment where I roleplayed a lusty little female halfling cleric for 5 years (and I was pretty darn good at it), suddenly doing it in person is daunting. I'm trying, though. So sometimes the person might just feel a little bit dumb doing it, and might just need some time to get used to it.

I'm not a shy person if I'm around people I know, and I'll talk about anything and anything if I'm in a gabby mood, so it's not just shyness; maybe a DM could lose perspective on how daunting the thought of roleplaying can be to a player, if the DM has many years under his/her belt? Just a thought

 

[Timeboxer]

...I would just like to point out that "my current players aren't really into deep characterization" is in no way equivalent to "powergamer."

 

[Henry]

Well whether or not it is, it's certainly a nice stripped-down and succinct advisory. Did you just come up with that?

Pretty much; the principles were already there (I'm a relatively recent disciple of Mr. Laws myself and somehow just seemed to map well to LEAD.

I do have that book (actually, I just reached out and snatched it from my bookshelf), and find his analysis interesting, but I actually think that it is very difficult to peg most players into just one of his categories.

Absolutely agree - but most people seem to be mappable to two of those "kicks" most of the time. It's not about square pegs and holes, it's about recognizing what element someone comes to get out of playing, and without which they feel like the session was not as fun. I surprised myself by realizing I was more of a Casual Gamer by his description, with Story-teller as a secondary trait.

But so far as that goes, I think it would be fair to say that my current players are closest to 1 butt-kicker, 2 specialists (one sneaky/ninja specialist and one druid/fairy/shaman specialist), and an occasional casual gamer. But they have similar tastes to me in SF, including some shows and books with complex characters and relationships. So I feel they have it in them.

The Casual Gamer is without doubt your hardest "sell" because by his or her nature, they don't like the spotlight a lot, though they'll take it sometimes. The butt-kicker is second-hardest, but doable if you can find some way to reward social interaction with combat. Didn't say it would be easy, just doable...

The 2 specialists, if you can find how interaction with the world can reward them with more opportunities to do what they do best, is the way to go. Because you know the players, and I don't, I'm afraid all I can speak in is generalities...

If it were my players, I'd say that the sneaky person is awarded by introducing them to people who need their services on a regular basis - the more they ingratiate themselves to the guildmaster/noble/kingpin of crime, the tougher and tougher jobs they get. The fairy/druid/shaman can be entreated by a superior or subordinate to save the Green in some fashion. If it were MY butt-kicker, I'd tell him that there are a few benevolent people who, if he can get in their good graces, he can point them to the servants of some nameless evil who need smiting. And the casual - well, if he's 100% - Robin - Laws - Textbook casual, there's nothing to say, he'll participate in the game, but won't put a lot of effort into social interaction. More likely, he has other interests as well that you can play on.

That's where I'd start, anyway.

 

[Wombat]

Actually it's not too hard to get people into a more "roleplaying" mode, with deeper characterizations.

I have one player who is a bit reluctant in this regard, so what I did was I asked her about her character's family history. She finally decided she was adopted. Fine. So I took a little time before one of our sessions for a bit of 1-on-1 roleplaying. She got to know her guardian a bit better and it "accidentally" slipped out that the guardian 1) knew who her birth-parents were and 2) why they had given her up for adoption, but spilled none of the specifics. Suddenly the player was bit -- why was she adopted?

I find one-on-one sessions, even very short ones, to be a great way to introduce a person to how to get into character and how to develop more of a background than "I kill monsters and take their treasure". The environment is somewhat "safer" and it is easier to build a mood. Heck, I even do this with my good roleplayers, simply because this creates opportunities to develope deeper background or explore a side of a character that is getting little outlet during normal gametime.

It's an idea, at least.

 

[Psion]

And the casual - well, if he's 100% - Robin - Laws - Textbook casual, there's nothing to say, he'll participate in the game, but won't put a lot of effort into social interaction.

Tell me about it. Said casual gamer is Mrs. Psion. She pretty much approaches the game as a board game and can't get into it unless we are maneuvering on a battlemat, and says she can't get into imagining conversations with NPCs. Which is a problem, since I am the sort of GM who shucks of the battlemat at the first opportunity.

 

[Thanee]

Find something, which interests them, and try to focus on that in a roleplaying scene, thereby catching their interest for the scene. Then proceed by giving them some hooks where they could start to roleplay their characters, or some help, if they don't seem to catch them.

Bye
Thanee