dread necromancer

[bestone]

5+1 known level 9 spells, oh !

How many can a wizard have? as many as there are
17 - 2
18 - 2 more
19 - 2 more
20 - 2 more

Thats 8 right there, plus whatever he chooses to add to his spellbook

Dn's are still limited, no matter how you look at it

 

[Bad Paper]

Look at the powers she gains over her levels. The charnel touch, the natural armor bonus, the DR... By the time the DN "becomes" a lich, she's basically already one, except for not being undead.

I would love to have access to whatever special edition of Heroes of Horror the authors have, but mine doesn't include a natural armor progression.

In fact, most of the nifty lich tricks just fall out of the sky: the immunities, the racial skill bonuses (boni?), the paralyzing touch, um, basically post #15. It's not a bad thing; it's just a little too much icing and not enough cake.

I would have liked a little more "progression." I like the DR progression model, that is, the DR gets halfway there and when you get 20th level, then it hits full. If I run this class I may do that for the other lichy tricks. I mean, you would think that something called "Mental Bastion" would give you some kind of bonus against [mind-affecting] spells!

Incidentally, CustServ says that the third-level death ward is an error.

I really like the Epic progression to Demilich, maybe at 30th level. What other nifty DN powers would a 30th level Dread Necromancer (demilich) have?

Rebuking undead gives you access to divine feats--with the high Charisma of a Dread Necromancer, Divine Spell Power is usually a good, solid choice.

except that the Dread Necromancer does not cast divine spells.

 

[Mouseferatu]

I would love to have access to whatever special edition of Heroes of Horror the authors have, but mine doesn't include a natural armor progression.

*blink*

Well, I'll be. That'll learn me to go from memory instead of opening the book.

Guess I was thinking of the fortification aspect...

 

[Victim]

Spectral Hand is the best friend of a Dread Necromancer--it lets those deadly touch spells be delivered from long range.

Also, there are a few good spells for creatures immune to necromancy. Black Tentacles and Acid Fog, for example.

Spectral Hand doesn't affect spells of 5th level or higher. No slay livings or Harms at range. So it's not actually that useful.

 

[lukelightning]

Yes... Something called flavour.

Hardy any class has flavor at epic levels. All they get are epic feats and some continued class abilities. And I would say that an epic dread necro slowly gaining demilich abilities amounts to flavor, the same way slowly becoming a lich over the first 20 levels is flavor

 

[seans23]

Methinks you should read Mass Harm a bit more carefully before you make that claim

Ummm ok. It's a will save, not a fort save, and death ward doesn't help you, which are the only claims I made.

 

[green slime]

Hardy any class has flavor at epic levels. All they get are epic feats and some continued class abilities. And I would say that an epic dread necro slowly gaining demilich abilities amounts to flavor, the same way slowly becoming a lich over the first 20 levels is flavor

But that ignores the fact that Demi-liches are basically very ancient, so ancient, their physical forms have all but withered away. Gaining 10 levels in a PrC even if epic, is hardly going to require eons. So that concept ignores the already existing flavour of Demi-Liches. IMNSHO, YMMV, etc,etc,etc.

 

[lukelightning]

But that ignores the fact that Demi-liches are basically very ancient, so ancient, their physical forms have all but withered away. Gaining 10 levels in a PrC even if epic, is hardly going to require eons. So that concept ignores the already existing flavour of Demi-Liches. IMNSHO, YMMV, etc,etc,etc.

Ah, that flavor. I thought you meant the flavor of the class. I'm in 100% agreement with you on this...my demilich suggestion was partially tongue-in-cheek.

 

[IcyCool]

To address the LA issue, I believe there is already precedent for not gaining the LA when the template is gained over a class like this. The Dragon Disciple does the same thing with the Half-Dragon template.

 

[Rystil Arden]

Ummm ok. It's a will save, not a fort save, and death ward doesn't help you, which are the only claims I made.

Unfortunately, your claims are not correct. Pay attention to the bold parts:

Harm charges a subject with negative energy that deals 10 points of damage per caster level (to a maximum of 150 points at 15th level). If the creature successfully saves, harm deals half this amount, but it cannot reduce the target’s hit points to less than 1.

If used on an undead creature, harm acts like heal.

The subject is immune to all death spells, magical death effects, energy drain, and any negative energy effects.

This spell doesn’t remove negative levels that the subject has already gained, nor does it affect the saving throw necessary 24 hours after gaining a negative level.

Death ward does not protect against other sorts of attacks even if those attacks might be lethal.

I'm afraid that you don't really have a case, unless I'm missing something obvious?