Elves don't Dream

[Once a Fool]

Here's a thought:

If elves do not sleep, that means they also do not dream. What would such a condition do to their psychology? If dreams offer insights into the inner workings of a mortal's mind, must the elves meditation period then be a substitute for this? What flavor in the world is lost for the elves if they cannot experience such deeply symbolic visions? Are they consequently less open to metaphore? Would this lead elves to interperate things far more literally than other races?

Any thoughts on this matter?

 

[wingsandsword]

Okay, elves don't "sleep" the same way that humans do, they call it "trance" in 3e, but the basic idea that they don't sleep the same way other races do was first introduced in 2e in the Complete Book of Elves (which while full of broken "crunch", did establish a lot of background on D&D elves which has been reused elsewhere).

What is in 3e called "trance" was referred to as "reverie" there. The basic idea is that elves spend their 4 hours resting in a deep meditative state, reflecting on events of the day and of their life. Instead of "dreaming" like humans would, they relive past events of their life, or imagine alternate outcomes to them, over and over. They might not have symbolic or surreal dreams, but a lifespan in the centuries, with a childhood lasting decades would give somebody plenty of time to grasp abstract concepts, even if they came to them slower than they would to a human.

This was part of the explanation for their resistance to Charm effects, that they have relived the events of their life so many times they know their own mind and desires quite well, and this gives them a measure of protection from effects which would tamper with their mind.

 

[taliesin15]

Dunno bout this. Clearly from the poetry in Tolkien, they sure are doing something close to dreaming.

 

[Valvorik]

run with it

makes them immune to Dream and Nightmare spells etc.

I have also used it to differentiate on other issues - e.g., worldspanning Cthulhoid threats that work through taking control of people via their dreams, which some elven racial supremists point to as one reason why these lesser, flawed races that dream must be destroyed.

 

[Olgar Shiverstone]

Do elves dream of androgynous sheep?

 

[Moon-Lancer]

even though they medetate, it says in phb 3.5 that they dream. odd part is, that spells like nightmare says they dont. very odd indeed.

edit* it is very strange. I would say that elves are ether not very imagnative, or VERY imagnative all the time, to the point that its debeliating, maybe thats why they are so magical, becuse they have full controle of thier mind.

 

[Once a Fool]

Dunno bout this. Clearly from the poetry in Tolkien, they sure are doing something close to dreaming.

Daydreaming maybe, but they can't have dreams independent of conscious guidance, if they never lose consciousness. They are, in Tolkien's work, more deeply connected with the spiritual world, but in D&D, it is a different matter. Of the many gifts given them, an inherent spiritual transcendence is not one of them.

That said, whatever gifts granted the sleeping races through dreams (prophecy, self-illumination, etc.) are denied to the elves, even through magical sleep. Sure, they have hundreds of years to come to terms with themselves, but only evolution of character will ever provide a new perspective. No epiphony borne on the tides of dreams will ever be forthcoming.

 

[Xath]

Maybe that's why it takes them so long to "grow up." Humans can gain insights and mental resolutions through subconsious sleep, but elves are forced to do it consiously? Therefore they'd have to take extra time to consciously rationalize things that humans don't even have to consider?

Maybe they're haughty for a reason. Frickin' conscious total mental control. Then that raises the question "Can elves go insane?"

 

[Klaus]

Maybe that's why it takes them so long to "grow up." Humans can gain insights and mental resolutions through subconsious sleep, but elves are forced to do it consiously? Therefore they'd have to take extra time to consciously rationalize things that humans don't even have to consider?

Maybe they're haughty for a reason. Frickin' conscious total mental control. Then that raises the question "Can elves go insane?"

Actually, according to Races of the Wild, an elf matures at pretty much the same rate as a human or half-elf. He/She just takes a long time experimenting with several professions and stuff like that before choosing a career path (for instance, if an elf wants a new house, he'll go out and learn bits of architecture and engineering to design his own house himself).

A long time ago (about 9 or 10 years), I read a short story in the Realms of Fantasy magazine where elves had a hard time learning from a situation, because their emotions would tint the experience so much. They could only rationalize and learn from experience after a looong while (long as in a decade or so), when the emotions would've been mostly forgotten and only the recolletcion of the experience would be left.

 

[Gez]

IMC, elves have a rather bad memory -- ties with their quasi faerie origins, they would tend to live in the NOW, not in the past. Their civilization only appeared after some elves discovered this trance that allows them to relive their past memories, and remember.

Which is to say, IMC, elves do sleep like everybody. They're just taught a special meditation methods that can replace sleep. As a bonus, this meditation also make them resist to sleep and dream spells.

The downside is that they have to use that meditation from time to time (at least once per week) if they don't want to forget things from their past. It's not a big burden, really.

Most elves prefer to sleep when they can, because it's more comfortable. But they'll always use the "trance" during journeys.