Help me build a Paladin/Sorcerer

[AuraSeer]

Though IDHMBWM, I believe the levels in Sacred Exorcist improve his turning ability.

 

[Elder-Basilisk]

At 7th level I could get a character with an AC around 33 or so who could be hitting every other round with a +30 or so after power attacking for 5 doing probably upwards of 30 damage a hit.

How do you manage 30 points of damage/hit? Assuming 20 strength after a bull's strength or other item, 20 charisma, a +2 greatsword, power attack and divine might I'm only getting

7 greatsword +7 strength, +2 enhancement, +5 Divine Might, +5 power attack =26 points of damage on average.

(I play a Ftr2/Wiz 6 at the moment so I'm looking for ways to increase my damage)

Elder-Basalisk: I have a few questions.

1. I know people usually don't like blur, but is it really that bad? If I have a very high armor class, I imagine that most enemies when they hit, will hit hard (probably with a crit.) Having a 1in5 chance of negating the damage, seems pretty good. Moreover, it makes me immune to sneak attacks. Also, it only has a V component so I could cast it when I get 2nd level spells and make it persistant later on. Also, if I take it, it would stack with the miss chance from blink.

1. blur has a range of touch so you can' t make it persistent. (Not that you'd want to).
2. It's unclear whether or not it would stack with the Blink miss chance which seems to be 50% concealment and 50% etherealness based on the different conditions that change the miss chance.
3. Immunity to sneak attacks isn't much of a worry if you've got AC 33. Rogues have a lot of trouble hitting high ACs. And there are other ways of becoming immune to sneak attacks that are actually useful for other things: Obscuring Mist, Blink, Displacement, Improved Invisibility, etc.
4. When you consider that the things that will hit your AC will probably do so on a roll of 17 or so (8th level raging 18 str barbarian with weapon focus, improved critical and a masterwork greatsword is +16 to hit--all hits will be critical threats) there's only a 4% chance that you will be struck with a confirmed critical. Blur changes that to a 3.2% chance. Not nearly as big of a difference as you might have thought. Compare it to adding two points of armor class through protection from evil which reduces the 4% chance of a successful critical to a 1% chance of a confirmed critical. A 20% miss chance doesn't look nearly as impressive in that light. . . .

2. I think Displacement requires a S component - IDHMBWM. This brings up the core of the issue though. It seems that there are a collection of spells that are all very similar and that I should choose only one of (maybe 2). Those spells are as follows:

invisibility
blur
blink
displacement
improved invisibility
mirror image

Blur has the advantage of not having a S component and if I took it, then I certainly would not take displacement. I am not sure which spell or combination of spells is the best out of this pool. I tend to think mirror image or invisibility or improved invisibility, blur or displacement, blink or displacement (although I suppose both would be quite devastating effectively 75% miss chance). Let me know what you think.

The spells overlap somewhat. These are the combos I would avoid:

Blur and Displacement
Blink and Improved Invisibility
Displacement and Blink
Improved Invisibility and Invisibility
Any kind of Invisibility and Mirror Image

I wouldn't worry about blink and blur or displacement stacking. Even if it worked (which I'm not sure it would) it would be overkill. Against the barbarian discussed earlier, if either displaced or blinking, you have only a 10% chance of being damaged by her primary attack and a 2.5% chance of being damaged by her secondary attack. If you used a second action to up the miss chance to 75%, you only reduce that to a 5% chance of taking damage from the primary attack and a 1.25% chance of taking damage from the secondary. That sounds impressive until you realize that by using Haste or Prot Evil instead, you end up with a 5% chance of taking damage from the primary attack and a 2.5% chance of taking damage from the secondary (Prot Evil) or a 2.5% chance of taking damage from either (Haste).

Other things to consider:
Blink and Improved Invisibility both deny your opponents their dex bonusses (and thus combine well with expert tactician).

Of all of those spells, only blink reduces your damage from area effect spells.

Of all thoses spells, only blink enables you to walk through walls and doors.

Of all those spells, only blink enables you to hit (or see) ethereal creatures.

Of all those spells, only blink should render you immune to grappling (it's not listed in the spell description but it makes sense).

Of all those spells, only blink gives you a miss chance.

Of all of those spells, only Invisibility and Improved Invisibility enable you to sneak past opponents.

The images produced by mirror image have an AC of 10 plus a little bit. Since your armor class is very high, it's likely that attackers will take out all your images with attacks that would have missed you anyway. So it doesn't buy you much.

All told, I'd go for Blink and Improved Invisibility if you're taking Expert Tactician. Otherwise, I'd probably just pick up improved invisibility or Invisibility and Displacement.

3. IDHMBWM as I already stated and I actually have not looked over the S.E. spells. I probably should before I make any further decisions about the character's spell list. However, the modified character is thus:

Feats:

Still Spell
Arcane Preparation
Cooperative Spell
Power Attack
Extra Turningx2
Divine Might
Extend Spell
Persistant Spell

+3 (need to check on Material components for Eschew Materials)

Spells

1st (5) - True Strike*, Featerfall*, Shield, Grease, Magic Missile
2nd (5) - Blur*, Web, Glitterdust
3rd (4) - Haste, Vampiric Touch, Slow, Blink
4th (4) - Polymorph Self*, Fireshield, Stoneskin
5th (4) - Wall of Force, Feeblemind, Telekinesis,
6th (3) - Geas*, Tensor's Transformation, Greater Dispelling
7th (3) - Teleport without Error*, Limited Wish, Power Word Stun*
8th (2) - Mind Blank, SunBurst
9th (1) - Time Stop*

I like grease and think it is too useful to pass up. On any significant incline it will be useful, it can work on an area I can't get to in melee to disarm, and as you said, no Spell Resistance.

I was thinking I ought to choose either Otto's irresistable dance or power word stun.

Yes--especially if you're picking up Expert Tactician. The more ways to make people lose their dex bonus the better.

I think the power word is better since neither allow a save and I get more 7th level spells. I am not sure about Sun burst, if I take glitterdust and/or blindness deafness, it seems like they may overlap a bit much.

Sun burst is a tac nuke against undead and the DC would be far far higher than either glitterdust or Blindness/Deafness. (Also it's an area effect unlike Blindness/Deafness and it's not a will save like glitterdust). There's a little bit of overlap there but I don't think it's too much.

 

[Gaiden]

I just returned from home where all of my books are and I realized just how good those exorcism domain spells are. Here is the up to date character:

Pal1/Fig1/Sor4/MotAO6/S.E.8 (unless someone can find a better PrC for 2 the last 2 levels of MotAO that I qualify for and makes sense for the concept).

Feats:

Still Spell
Arcane Preparation
Cooperative Spell
Power Attack
Extra Turningx2
Divine Might
Extend Spell
Persistant Spell
Combat Reflexes
Expert Tactician
Eschew Materials

Spells:

1st (5+d) - True Strike*, Featerfall*, Shield, Grease, Magic Missile, Protection from Evil
2nd (5+d) - Web, Glitterdust, Bull's Strength, Eagle's Splendor, Endurance, Magic Circle Against Evil
3rd (4+d) - Haste, Vampiric Touch, Slow, Blink, Remove Curse
4th (4+d) - Polymorph Self*, Fireshield, Stoneskin, Dismissal
5th (4+d) - Wall of Force, Feeblemind, Telekinesis,
6th (3+d) - Geas*, Tensor's Transformation, Greater Dispelling, Banishment
7th (3+d) - Teleport without Error*, Limited Wish, Power Word Stun*, Holy Word
8th (2+d) - Mind Blank, SunBurst, Holy Aura
9th (1+d) - Time Stop*, Unbinding

I am stil not sure about Eschew Materials (my friend has my PHB now so I can't go back and check which spells have M/F).

Also, I am not sure about Vampiric Touch. It seems like a great option but also seems counter to the Paladin image.

Finally it seems like there is a lot of overlap between glitterdust, holy word, and Sunburst. GLitterdust serves as my invisibility purge, while Sunburst serves as the undead purge. Holy word I get for free. HOwever, given that they all blind, it seems that maybe I could choose other spells that would have greater synergy or at least not overlap so much. Given my requirement to take Holy word, what do you all think? Also given that I have the stat boosters, limited wish, and am a sorcerer. Would it be useful to exchange eschew materials for empower spell?

How do you manage 30 points of damage/hit? Assuming 20 strength after a bull's strength or other item, 20 charisma, a +2 greatsword, power attack and divine might I'm only getting

7 greatsword +7 strength, +2 enhancement, +5 Divine Might, +5 power attack =26 points of damage on average.

(I play a Ftr2/Wiz 6 at the moment so I'm looking for ways to increase my damage)

Let's see, I took a guess with that number.

Assuming 16's in Str and Chr to start with and stat increases with enhancement bonuses I figured I would have probably a 20 Str and Chr.

4.5 (medium weapon) +6 PA, +5 strength, +1 enhancement, +5 DM, +3.5 energy enhancement, +1 prayer (from cleric). I guess I come up with 26 too. I tend to roll pretty luck though and would probably wind up with an 18 in chr though possibly bumping up the DM by 2 (with stat increase and maxed out E.S.). Also, I could have a better weapon pushing me over the mark but would probably stick with shield and sword style for the added defense. Also calculating in criticals would probably increase the average damage by around 1 point or so.

I am assuming this guy would come in with my current party where we have a Cle6/RSoP1 who loves to cast buff spells and healing spells.

 

[AuraSeer]

(my friend has my PHB now so I can't go back and check which spells have M/F)

This looks like a job for the SRD!

 

[Gaiden]

The Disciple of Pelor

I have listed the final 20th level stats. I am unsure as to what level he will start at so I just planned his entire career.



Pal1/Fig1/Sor4/MotAO6/S.E.8

Skills:

Concentration (maxed)
Spell Craft (maxed)
Diplomacy
Alchemy
Craft
Knowledge (as many as possible)
Intimidate (maxed)

Feats:

Still Spell
Arcane Preparation
Cooperative Spell
Power Attack
Extra Turningx2
Divine Might
Combat Reflexes
Expert Tactician
Eschew Materials
Quicken Spell
Close Quarters Fighting

Spells:
0th (9) - Detect Magic, Read Magic, Yell*, Light*, Deftness, Zap Trap, Glittering Razors, Prestidigitation, Dancing Lights
1st (5+d) - True Strike*, Featerfall*, Shield, Grease, Magic Missile, Protection from Evil
2nd (5+d) - Web, Glitterdust, Invisibility, Endurance, Summon Swarm, Magic Circle Against Evil
3rd (4+d) - Haste, Vampiric Touch, Slow, Blink, Remove Curse
4th (4+d) - Polymorph Self*, Fireshield, Charm Monster, Stone Skin, Dismissal
5th (4+d) - Wall of Force, Feeblemind, Telekinesis, Summon Monster V, Dispel Evil
6th (3+d) - Geas*, Tensor's Transformation, Greater Dispelling, Banishment
7th (3+d) - Teleport without Error*, Limited Wish, Power Word Stun*, Holy Word*
8th (2+d) - Mind Blank, SunBurst, Holy Aura
9th (1+d) - Time Stop*, Unbinding

Equipment - Cloak of charisma (highest bonus available), Ghosttouched Full Plate Armor of Command, Spellstoring Ghost touched defending holy armor spikes, Spellstoring Ghost touched keened holy two handed weapon with reach, Boots of Spring and Striding, Items giving +30 to skills (especially listen and spot), Wand of Holy Sword, Wand of Bless Weapon, Wand of attack spell (some arcane firepower-spell), Ring of Wizardry, Ring of Evasion, Immovable Rods, Scrolls, Potions, Pearl's of Power,

Use spell pool to get permanancy for all spells that need long duration for.

Use spell pool for contingency.

Use spell pool for any other spells that give permanent durations.

Use limited wish for divine power.

If character ever went epic, would take levels of dragon disciple and take two weapon fighting feats to dual wield reach weapon and armor spikes.

Hope you like.

 

[Rel]

I like the look of your character, Gaiden. He looks like he'd be fun to play.

But the real reason for my post is to say that someone once told me, "Every post ever posted by Elder-Basalisk is worth reading."

I have found this to be true in virtually every instance. This thread is a perfect example.

So I just wanted to take a moment to thank E-B for the incredible value I think he lends to these forums and to let him know that the time and thought that obviously go into his posts are greatly appreciated by myself and, I'm quite certain, a host of others.

 

[Gaiden]

I completely forgot about the fact that blink makes grapple attacks irrelevant. That is why I picked up close quarters combat. I figured with an incredibly high AC, and a reach weapon, most people would want to grapple me or silence me to defeat me. Close quarters combat seemed a good option (especially in conjunction with combat reflexes), not to mention I would have armor spikes if they got past the reach. However, I am not sure it is such a good idea now.

I might take craft magic arms and armor instead - what do you all think?

 

[Dr. NRG]

Rel, as a frequent lurker and infrequent poster here, I second your point on E-B.

NRG