immortals handbook

[CRGreathouse]

Hey U_K! I hoped that I would be able to delay this day until I had a copy of your book in my hands... but campaigns go on, sometimes faster than we expect. One of my characters is just moments away from his apotheosis... and we don't have rules to cover it. It's OK at the moment; he's away from the party, and DM handwaving will work for a while. After that, though, I'm using D&Dg to handle it, since those are the only do-it-yourself divine rules I have to work with: the IH isn't out yet, and The Divine and the Defeated doesn't have an explained metasystem.

I would like to make the character as compatible as possible with the IH rules, though, so it'll be easier to convert when the time comes. In particular, I'd like to know about portfolios.

The character in question is an archer, a devout worshipper of Nike, the goddess of victory (divine rank 6, a weak Lesser Deity; LG, but historically LN). The character is a Cleric12/Divine Agent9 or so, and has (almost) gained sponsorship from Nike.

So far, I've considered making his area of control "arrogance" -- in his religion, false modesty is a sin, and it's not one he's ever been guilty of. This portfolio wouldn't include hubris, the overextention of arrogance and pride; it would include only rightful pride taken to its extreme.

Is there any good way to do this? Do you have any suggestions that would work for the character? He's an archer, a military strategist (having won a significant battle earlier in his career), and a successful diplomat (having 'won' a nation's freedom, in a sense).

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hey U_K!

Hiya CRGreathouse matey!

I hoped that I would be able to delay this day until I had a copy of your book in my hands... but campaigns go on, sometimes faster than we expect. One of my characters is just moments away from his apotheosis... and we don't have rules to cover it.

I feel terrible about the prolonged delay. I can only say that I have since learned my lesson (not to overstretch myself) and after this it won't happen again.

It's OK at the moment; he's away from the party, and DM handwaving will work for a while. After that, though, I'm using D&Dg to handle it, since those are the only do-it-yourself divine rules I have to work with: the IH isn't out yet, and The Divine and the Defeated doesn't have an explained metasystem.

I would like to make the character as compatible as possible with the IH rules, though, so it'll be easier to convert when the time comes. In particular, I'd like to know about portfolios.

Okay.

The character in question is an archer, a devout worshipper of Nike, the goddess of victory (divine rank 6, a weak Lesser Deity; LG, but historically LN). The character is a Cleric12/Divine Agent9 or so, and has (almost) gained sponsorship from Nike.

Fair enough.

So far, I've considered making his area of control "arrogance" -- in his religion, false modesty is a sin, and it's not one he's ever been guilty of. This portfolio wouldn't include hubris, the overextention of arrogance and pride; it would include only rightful pride taken to its extreme.

Is there any good way to do this?

Well the simplest way would be to create an Arrogance Portfolio.

I must admit I don't have one in the IH (thats not one of the 48), but I do have rules for creating your own which are fairly easy to follow.

I also advocate that when creating any Portfolio you create an exact opposite Portfolio...a nemesis Portfolio if you will. So if you created an Arrogance Portfolio you might also create a Humility Portfolio.

Do you have any suggestions that would work for the character? He's an archer, a military strategist (having won a significant battle earlier in his career), and a successful diplomat (having 'won' a nation's freedom, in a sense).

There are so many potential options that I could make any number of suggestions.

I generally advocate the player chooses one Portfolio and the DM chooses the other.

Personally I could see an 'Arrogance' Portfolio working well with the 'Good' Portfolio.

Then you could concoct a nemesis who had the 'Humility' Portfolio and the 'Evil' Portfolio...unusual mix that. Hes evil, but he doesn't like to boast about it. In fact he could be a hidden evil that lurks in the shadows, even other gods may not have heard of him.

Player: "I am the vanguard of victory! The strategist supreme! The archer without equal! Who are you evil one?"

Nemesis: "No one of consequence."

I'm thinking he could be called Anonimaz...what do you think?

Don't know if any of that helps? Sometimes I just go off on a tangent.

 

[CRGreathouse]

Hiya CRGreathouse matey!



I feel terrible about the prolonged delay. I can only say that I have since learned my lesson (not to overstretch myself) and after this it won't happen again.

Don't take it the wrong way, I'm quite happy with what I've seen of your work so far, and I'd certainly prefer that you do it right instead of rushing it. I was just asking for conversion ideas... I don't want to end up 'revising' history when I get the IH.

Well the simplest way would be to create an Arrogance Portfolio.

I must admit I don't have one in the IH (thats not one of the 48), but I do have rules for creating your own which are fairly easy to follow.

I also advocate that when creating any Portfolio you create an exact opposite Portfolio...a nemesis Portfolio if you will. So if you created an Arrogance Portfolio you might also create a Humility Portfolio.

So making new portfolios works? Good. (You'll excuse the sentiment, I hope; without knowing how portfolios work in the IH, I can't tell if the system can stretch. There's plenty of room for new domains, for example, but no room for more alignments, really. I couldn't tell if it would work more like the former or the latter; open or closed, if you will.)

There are so many potential options that I could make any number of suggestions.

I generally advocate the player chooses one Portfolio and the DM chooses the other.

Personally I could see an 'Arrogance' Portfolio working well with the 'Good' Portfolio.

Then you could concoct a nemesis who had the 'Humility' Portfolio and the 'Evil' Portfolio...unusual mix that. Hes evil, but he doesn't like to boast about it. In fact he could be a hidden evil that lurks in the shadows, even other gods may not have heard of him.

Player: "I am the vanguard of victory! The strategist supreme! The archer without equal! Who are you evil one?"

Nemesis: "No one of consequence."

I'm thinking he could be called Anonimaz...what do you think?

Don't know if any of that helps? Sometimes I just go off on a tangent.

That is truly a brilliant idea. I absolutely love this... especially the idea for the nemesis. Now I really can't wait for the IH!

Evil and humility, what fun. I'll have to use that whenever I get a chance.

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hello again mate!

Don't take it the wrong way, I'm quite happy with what I've seen of your work so far, and I'd certainly prefer that you do it right instead of rushing it.

I appreciate the support mate, I assure you it will be worth the wait.

I was just asking for conversion ideas... I don't want to end up 'revising' history when I get the IH.

That shouldn't really be a problem.

So making new portfolios works? Good. (You'll excuse the sentiment, I hope; without knowing how portfolios work in the IH, I can't tell if the system can stretch. There's plenty of room for new domains, for example, but no room for more alignments, really. I couldn't tell if it would work more like the former or the latter; open or closed, if you will.)

Yes. There was never anyway I could detail every possible Portfolio so I have left it at 48 with rules on how to create your own.

Some Portfolios may of course be simply variations on existing Portfolios or more specific sub-Portfolios.

That is truly a brilliant idea. I absolutely love this... especially the idea for the nemesis. Now I really can't wait for the IH!

Well there are dozens of ideas in the IH for making character creation or adventure hooks automatic extensions of the rules.

As well as the Nemesis idea there is also the Council idea, whereupon you have deities grouped by Portfolio. So you have the Aetnean Council (all Fire deities) or the Council of Undeath, etc.

So as well as just Pantheon interaction you can have Council interaction. You can also belong to both Pantheons and Councils; so you get that conflict of interests.

Of course then you have your racial Pantheons; and your ethical Pantheons and then your dimensional hierarchies but no point going into all that now, I've probably said too much already.

Evil and humility, what fun. I'll have to use that whenever I get a chance.

Glad I could help mate!

 

[Clay_More]

Hey Krust

I was just wondering, are the any added benefits of having the same portfolio twice? Has each Portfolio got a description for what happens if it is taken a second time?

Given any thought to how you will incorporate the weaknesses found in many divine entities from existing myth so that they can be transferred to D&D? I am referring to such things as the weak heel of Achille's or Balder's vulnerability to Misteltoe (which could be handled with a simple DR -/Mistletoe, but still).

I thought of the weaknesses when BardStephen talked about the weakness of characters earlier. To a deity, it is a rather colorful addition, as long as the weakness doesn't make him too easy to slay. I have yet to see a D&D deity (as far as I know) that has a weakness similar to mythological figures.

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hey Krust

Hiya mate!

I actually tried posting earlier but the boards were not responding.

I was just wondering, are the any added benefits of having the same portfolio twice? Has each Portfolio got a description for what happens if it is taken a second time?

Yes.

Given any thought to how you will incorporate the weaknesses found in many divine entities from existing myth so that they can be transferred to D&D?

Yes, I am developing weaknesses as well, I think they are looking fairly good at the moment, but they need a bit more testing.

They work like negative Gifts.

I am referring to such things as the weak heel of Achille's or Balder's vulnerability to Misteltoe (which could be handled with a simple DR -/Mistletoe, but still).

Both of those powers can be found amongst the Divine Gifts in one form or another.

I thought of the weaknesses when BardStephen talked about the weakness of characters earlier. To a deity, it is a rather colorful addition, as long as the weakness doesn't make him too easy to slay. I have yet to see a D&D deity (as far as I know) that has a weakness similar to mythological figures.

Well as I see it the only way to balance weaknesses is to counterbalance them with Gifts.

eg. You can take one weakness and two gifts instead of a single gift.

I haven't decided on the parameters of this though, possibly a maximum of one weakness per status. I'm still reviewing this.

 

[Orco42]

Hi UK!

Just come back to the boards from a long break. And I am very glad to see that you are still at it.

Just wanted to know if you had any ETA for completion of the IH (i've scanned the last few pages and fit looks as if you are close).

I've had a player on a quest to become a goddess for almost a year of real time and she is getting close to completion. Just wondering if I should try to stretch it out longer to wait for IH or use D&Dg until it comes out.

Thanks!

ps. If I were a female I would have your baby. But since I am not I guess I'll just have to name my first born after you.

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hi UK!

Just come back to the boards from a long break.

Hi Orco42 matey!!!

Long time no see, I trust you have been keeping well?

And I am very glad to see that you are still at it.

Well I really should have had it finished by now.

Just wanted to know if you had any ETA for completion of the IH (i've scanned the last few pages and fit looks as if you are close).

Close-ish.

I have an idea when it will be finished but I don't like getting burnt by saying when, so essentially it will be ready when its ready.

I've had a player on a quest to become a goddess for almost a year of real time and she is getting close to completion. Just wondering if I should try to stretch it out longer to wait for IH or use D&Dg until it comes out.

Well, my rules are far better than anything in that book. Also you have to remember that they don't really have any rules for apotheosis in D&Dg anyway.

There are various quests you have to go on to obtain divinity (as well as gaining worship points); so you could use either Pantheon quests; Portfolio Quests (among others) as a stalling measure.

Thanks!

Anytime mate! Good to hear from you again.

ps. If I were a female I would have your baby. But since I am not I guess I'll just have to name my first born after you.

'Upper' sounds a bit of a weird name, not sure if you should inflict that on a kid.

 

[Chosen01]

Hey Krust, did you see the news today? There will be an SRD update this week but it's not clear if there is any new material added. Will you revise the IH again if the ELH and/or D&DG enters the SRD?

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hey Krust,

Hi Chosen01 mate!

did you see the news today? There will be an SRD update this week but it's not clear if there is any new material added.

Yes its a little ambiguous as to whats being updated. It doesn't look like the ELH will be going in as yet.

Will you revise the IH again if the ELH and/or D&DG enters the SRD?

Not to any great extent (in fact almost none at this point), it would mean I could better refer to certain areas but other than the full list of epic feats to draw upon for my examples it won't impact the IH very much.