D&D 5E Krynn's Free Feats: setting-specific or the future of the game?

[overgeeked]

okay... but I got my benfit from the slot...

or not... cause if food matters it is most likely at the end of the adventure day, like when my Druid use to just burn all his leftover slots on good berry to last until the start of the next long rest...

what if I don't want to or don't have nuke spells?

Cut to the chase. What point are you trying to make?

 

[GMforPowergamers]

Only in that you have to choose that cantrip over others.

why is picking 1 cantrip over another important but picking 1 background feature over another not?

like I can make food at will or I can move 5lbs of weight with my mind at will, or I can make little balls of light at will

I can scavenge for food always, or I can have 3 servants, or I can know some secrete of the world...

both are opportunity cost

But really, why this is a Background Feature anyways and not just a function of Wisdom (Survival) checks?

going down this train of thought can lead to no feats, no skills, no tool prof, no classes... just 6 stats and everything is a stat check

 

[Monayuris]

That’s fine. I just won’t be updating to 5.5.

I dislike Feats too, never used them in 5E. Now, branching Background trees....this I can get behind.

I like the background abilities. I wouldn’t mind them branching out to expand at higher levels.

But at least with what backgrounds I’ve been exposed to ( original PHB),they generally grant out of combat / role playing/ downtime benefits that don’t compound the issues I have with feats.

I would definitely like to see backgrounds expand the scope of what PCs can do out of combat / downtime
.

 

[GMforPowergamers]

Cut to the chase. What point are you trying to make?

that I don't understand how a non combat pillar ability (often called a ribbon) is any different then another non combat pillar ability

 

[Parmandur]

I like the background abilities. I wouldn’t mind them branching out to expand at higher levels.

But at least with what backgrounds I’ve been exposed to ( original PHB),they generally grant out of combat / role playing/ downtime benefits that don’t compound the issues I have with feats.

I would definitely like to see backgrounds expand the scope of what PCs can do out of combat / downtime
.

One of my issues with Feats has been how stale they have been as a la Carte options. My wife's eyes glazed over the first time I tried to explain what they even are, and she was glad when I said she could ignore them, as everyone I game with does.

Using the same technique with flavor like Theros and Ravenloft, though? That's interesting, and creates something people can chew on and digest. Making this a normal part of the game just makes sense.

 

[overgeeked]

going down this train of thought can lead to no feats, no skills, no tool prof, no classes... just 6 stats and everything is a stat check

That would be amazing. You don't have to stop there. Keep going.

 

[Vaalingrade]

That would be amazing. You don't have to stop there. Keep going.

Super simple, classic, OG roleplaying.

"I hit you" "No you didn't" ~proceeds to get into a slap fight~

No options, no rules, no design, just whose mom could get there first and take the side of her little angel.

Ah, perfection.

 

[overgeeked]

that I don't understand how a non combat pillar ability (often called a ribbon) is any different then another non combat pillar ability

It's all about fictional positioning and permission.

There's a difference between "I spend time scrounging for food and possibly fail" and "I spend a spell slot and instantly acquire food."

If you zoom way, way out...they're both non-combat ribbon abilities. But that misses, intentionally, the differences between them.

In one, the fiction is you're a well-traveled Outlander who has survived by wits alone and knows where to find food and water in the wild places between so-called civilization. In the other, the fiction is you're a magician to can magically summon food on command.

There's also the opportunity cost, as mentioned.

What's the difference between two non-combat ribbon abilities? All the actual differences between them.

 

[Jaeger]

yeah cause that fighter with 13hp and a +4 to hit for 1d8+2 damage is totally superman...

5e does tilt the XP charts so that you blow through he first three levels in record time compared to past editions.

So maybe not superman - but 5e does all it can to get PC's out of the traditional early level 'danger zone' as soon as it can.

WotC devs should just admit what they want to do; start everyone at lvl3, and call it lvl 1.

Feats were promised to be optional.

If it is no longer to be the case I will be out for 5.5.

I’ll use feats when I feel like it but there are times I will want to say no. I prefer to have the choice based on the my own preference.

Well, Mearls had to fight his own dev team to simplify 5e as much as he did.

Mearls is out, so his old team is gonna do what they're gonna do.

5.5 will be as backwards compatible as past edition promises of backwards compatibility...

I just think it gives too much of an incentive to select a background based on its mechanical impact.

Which is exactly what will happen. There was a reason lots of 3e parties had half-orc fighters...

I mean, it was obviously intended for the Background Feature to matter in games, but it often is vestigial with no real benefit, especially in public play. I remember my noble getting zero benefit for being a noble, and then one time when we needed shelter, I announced I'd ask the local lord to put us up in his keep, using my feature, and the DM actually said "I mean, I guess, but I don't understand how that works, the guy has never heard of you."

When I get pushback on simply finding my party a place to sleep for the night, it's obvious (to me) that a component of backgrounds has failed to work as advertised.

A lot of space in the PHB is devoted to Backgrounds, so I don't think they were intended to be vestigial, yet they certainly can be, and you do get DM's who say "you have no right or expectation for your Background to matter".

I have found in play that backgrounds, and all that traits ideal bonds are completely vestigial. Because they are entirely subject to GM fiat.

They could be jettisoned from PC creation entirely, and most people wouldn't notice the difference in their games.

 

[James Gasik]

why is picking 1 cantrip over another important but picking 1 background feature over another not?

like I can make food at will or I can move 5lbs of weight with my mind at will, or I can make little balls of light at will

I can scavenge for food always, or I can have 3 servants, or I can know some secrete of the world...

both are opportunity cost

going down this train of thought can lead to no feats, no skills, no tool prof, no classes... just 6 stats and everything is a stat check

A lot of the times, when I discuss things about 5e I don't particularly like, say for example, how using a Cure Wounds in combat doesn't feel great, or how I wish there were better options for a more 4e-ish Fighter (say, a Battlemaster who can perform maneuvers every turn, but isn't broken based on bonus damage dice), someone usually comes along to point out that you can change the game to allow for that.

If you want this or that element to be different, you're allowed to change it, that's the beauty of 5e and why it's the most popular version of D&D that has ever existed.*

*Some hyperbole here, but not really that much.

But when I flip that point around and say "well then, if something exists in the game that you don't like, you can also just get rid of it", people seem confused. So what if WotC decides Feats are core in the future?

You still don't have to use them, and even if WotC claims they are assumed in the expectations of the game, so what if the game is harder? I hear a lot of people claim 5e is easy mode anyways.

Or let's look at one of the big "optional" parts of the game. Magic Items. We're told they are optional, but many people assume that magic weapons will appear at some point. Heck, there's a sidebar in Xanathar's discussing how the game changes if magic weapons aren't around, and how certain class features and spells become much more important to make up for their non-existence...

If I can be told that "the game works fine because rule zero exists" then that should be universally true.