D&D (2024) My proposed fix for the Monk

[Zaukrie]

I really don't understand the devs' insistence in such a hard distinction between unarmed strikes and weapon attacks. From my perspective, there is really no good reason not to make unarmed strikes a weapon. It would simplify so many features, and open up a ton of design space and build options.

Sure, I can see plenty of unintended consequences, but pretty much all of them are either hilarious or badass, and none that I can think of would break the game.

Agreed, it is pretty hard to break the game (in home play, not official play) anyway. The GM can control anything they want....a point or two of AC or a few extra HPs or more uses of Ki//Di/Focus isn't going to break the game.....

 

[fuindordm]

So what would a component-less spell look like?

I don't want magic without components. To borrow a page from the HERO system, I think of components as limitations on magic, or ways that other people can prevent you from spellcasting.
A magical tradition will teach spellcasting with one major and one minor limitation. Needing to talk (V) is a major limitation because it is easy to gag the wizard and it stops stealth. Needing to gesture with one hand (S) is a minor limitation (no impact on stealth).
Another magical tradition might require full-body somatic gestures (dance), drawing runes on a surface with special chalk, preparing potions that the caster or recipient of the magic must drink, a full round of concentration, holding a fragile focus prominently in hand, etc. as a major limitation, instead of magic words.

 

[fuindordm]

Okay, I've updated the first post with a few suggestions:

My goal was to reduce the MAD of the base class while boosting it up to the baseline of the other warriors classes.

Using Wisdom for attacks and HP would reduce the need to boost CON, so you can focus entirely on DEX and WIS. However, I can understand if this is a bridge too far for some.

Your latest version is nice and not too different from the base class.

Since they have the option to use Wis or Str for unarmed attacks, I guess you can make a Str-based monk without ditching your AC. That's a nice feature. Going a little further down that road, do you think the class design can support (Str, Dex), (Wis, Dex), and (Str, Wis) monks to an equal degree, and make each choice feel significantly different?

For example, some traditional martial arts teach forms for 2-handed weapons. Maybe a Str monk can reach higher damage outputs at lower levels by wielding large weapons. Maybe the Wis monk gets more Focus points to play with.

 

[ChameleonX]

Your latest version is nice and not too different from the base class.

Since they have the option to use Wis or Str for unarmed attacks, I guess you can make a Str-based monk without ditching your AC. That's a nice feature. Going a little further down that road, do you think the class design can support (Str, Dex), (Wis, Dex), and (Str, Wis) monks to an equal degree, and make each choice feel significantly different?

For example, some traditional martial arts teach forms for 2-handed weapons. Maybe a Str monk can reach higher damage outputs at lower levels by wielding large weapons. Maybe the Wis monk gets more Focus points to play with.

As far as I can tell, there's nothing in this version that necessarily prevents you from using two-handed weapons. You just don't get to use Wisdom for attack and damage rolls, and you forgo the bonus action attack in exchange for bigger damage and (I would imagine) Polearm Master support.

As is, focusing on Strength and Dex, you'd just be sacrificing your Ki Save DC. Strength and Wis would just give you a slightly lower AC and force you to use thrown weapons for ranged attacks. Dex and Wis is, of course, the default, and would probably leave you a few extra points to drop in CON.

 

[ChameleonX]

I don't want magic without components. To borrow a page from the HERO system, I think of components as limitations on magic, or ways that other people can prevent you from spellcasting.
A magical tradition will teach spellcasting with one major and one minor limitation. Needing to talk (V) is a major limitation because it is easy to gag the wizard and it stops stealth. Needing to gesture with one hand (S) is a minor limitation (no impact on stealth).
Another magical tradition might require full-body somatic gestures (dance), drawing runes on a surface with special chalk, preparing potions that the caster or recipient of the magic must drink, a full round of concentration, holding a fragile focus prominently in hand, etc. as a major limitation, instead of magic words.

In my own fictional world, the main limitations on magic are that it runs off the same fuel source as the rest of your body, so overuse of magic has the same effects as starvation. If you burn through too much mana without thinking, you pass out, and can end up with tissue damage, organ failure, or just die.

Also, it's a blind mechanism that relies on your own understanding to work, so if you can't visualize how the spell works, it doesn't. To heal someone, you need to know the basics of anatomy and medicine. To make something explode, you need to know how combustion works, etc. The more knowledge you have, the more subtle and complex your magic can be.

 

[Jefe Bergenstein]

Imagine playing a STR based monk. Wouldn't that be a treat

That would be nice. Pathfinder 2E's Mountain Stance gives +4 AC among other benefits, but you don't apply your Dex to AC. A friend was playing a stronk (str monk) in our game for a while. Basically the big tough guy like Bolo Yeung. It's a shame WOTC is missing such a MA/anime archetype.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

Imagine playing a STR based monk. Wouldn't that be a treat

Yep. This is why my swordmage style monk rewrite has AC of 13+Int Mod but doesn’t use Int to attack. You can be Str or Dex pretty easily.

My duelist can use medium armor and choose to use wisdom in place of Dex when calculating AC in armor.