NEW Immortals Handbook - Ascension thread

[historian]

Samael is actually listed as one of the evil names of the demi-urge in gnostic mysticism. I just looked it up. Apparently he is the enemy of Metatron as well. I shoulda figured something online would say something about him...or rather it.

I think I would estimate Samael to be a Stage II Demiurge.

Apropo the rivalry with Metatron wouldn't that suggest Stage I? If Samael were Stage II there shouldn't be a Metatron in his reality.

 

[dante58701]

Maybe Samael is just one of many Demiurges? The gnostics are not very clear about how many demiurges there are within our particular omniverse. It seems to me that Samael might in truth be a mere aspect of a vastly more powerful Time Lord, one that encompasses both good and evil.

Samael always struck me as an intrusion into our reality. Though, if Metatron were spawned from Samael, it could certainly explain why they hate each other so much. The rebelliously good son essentially flipping his evil father the bird.

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hey all!

Regarding Samael, I honestly can't remember what I was thinking when I placed him amidst the Demiurges. That might be an error, I thought I had him pegged as an Old One.

There are a number of complications around the Asmodeus, Lucifer, Samael, Satan type personae.

Lets see.

Satan is basically the same as Tharizdun, hes the Elder Elemental God - First One.

Lucifer is the former ruler of Hell, and a Greater Power. Lucifer may be the Avatar of Samael the fallen Seraphim.

Asmodeus is the current ruler of Hell, and an Intermediate Power. Asmodeus might be a servant (or former servant) of the Persian greater deity Ahriman.

So Samael could be the Old One that embodies the Nine Hells, just as each of the Seraphim embody one of the upper planes.

I should note that originally I had Asmodeus as a Lesser Power and Lucifer as a mere Intermediate power but I no longer think that is right.

Does any of the above make sense...?

 

[dante58701]

Ok...so Samael is an Old One, and the others are more or less as stated as well. This clears things up for me then. Except for one detail.

Were Samael to produce offspring via Female Human Sacrifice, and sick sick cultists. Would the offspring be an Intermediate Deity or a Lesser Deity Equivalent Abomination.

Or would the child be an Intermediate Deity and the afterbirth a Lesser Deity Equivalent Abomination.

The reason I'm asking is were playing a campaign where the child of Samael is produced via a Human mother and the afterbirth becomes an abomination that the child of Samael must either destroy or tame somehow. The primary conflict is supposed to be between Samaels son and the afterbirth abomination so unless this isn't feasable...it's where the campaign is leading.

The mother, as a result of this horrific taint is also suppossed to become an Abomination, although she will only be a quasi-deity equivalent. She'll have an exposed belly and whatnot. It's all very Silent Hill'ish.


I've just noted that you have Abaddon as the Nine Hells. So how could Samael be the Nine Hells? Isn't Abaddon a servant of Samael?

Scratch that...I just read that Abaddon and Samael are one and the same. So...that means you did have it right with Samael being an Old One.

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hi dante mate!

Ok...so Samael is an Old One, and the others are more or less as stated as well. This clears things up for me then. Except for one detail.

Were Samael to produce offspring via Female Human Sacrifice, and sick sick cultists. Would the offspring be an Intermediate Deity or a Lesser Deity Equivalent Abomination.

Or would the child be an Intermediate Deity and the afterbirth a Lesser Deity Equivalent Abomination.

The union between a Sidereal and a mortal would result in an Intermediate Deity.

Only the birth of Pantheons results in cosmic afterbirth and things like that.

The reason I'm asking is were playing a campaign where the child of Samael is produced via a Human mother and the afterbirth becomes an abomination that the child of Samael must either destroy or tame somehow. The primary conflict is supposed to be between Samaels son and the afterbirth abomination so unless this isn't feasable...it's where the campaign is leading.

The mother, as a result of this horrific taint is also suppossed to become an Abomination, although she will only be a quasi-deity equivalent. She'll have an exposed belly and whatnot. It's all very Silent Hill'ish.

What you could do is just say that the mother gives birth to twins, each a Lesser deity in terms of power ~ one of which is the monstrous abomination.

I've just noted that you have Abaddon as the Nine Hells. So how could Samael be the Nine Hells? Isn't Abaddon a servant of Samael?

Scratch that...I just read that Abaddon and Samael are one and the same. So...that means you did have it right with Samael being an Old One.

Its about time I got something right.

 

[Pssthpok]

Hi there, UK.

How's the portfolio format conversion coming along?

Will we see an update on Sunday or Monday?

How's Gods and Monsters? Will version 6 be included?

 

[dante58701]

That's a good question my gaming group is dying to test out that new vampire beastie of yours.

What monsters are there thus far?

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hi there, UK.

Hiya mate!

How's the portfolio format conversion coming along?

The 'fly in the ointment' is the weaknesses, if I can get those sorted I should have all the tables done for Tuesday.

Will we see an update on Sunday or Monday?

Unfortunately I have to go out on Monday. But I will definately update on Tuesday.

How's Gods and Monsters?

I've got virtually everything decided, one or two monster ideas I am still toying with other than that should be very straightforward once I get Ascension out of the way. The Pantheon creation stuff I basically have written ~ although not typed up as yet.

Thinking about it, I don't see any reason why I couldn't have it finished within a month of Ascension, its all pretty straightforward.

Will version 6 be included?

No, it will be a seperate pdf. I've (stupidly) done about 2-3 days work on it over the past week and I could probably have it finished within a week if I devoted my time to it*. It will be about 40 pages (although that will include the 4 Size, VSC, Damage etc. pages from the Bestiary) which were the update of v5's Design Parameters.

*But don't worry, I know to get Ascension done. My momentary lapse into v6, Gods & Monsters and other IH related 'stuff' has faded.

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hiya mate!

That's a good question my gaming group is dying to test out that new vampire beastie of yours.

What monsters are there thus far?

I'll post a list of monsters in Gods & Monsters when I get a final line-up, still one or two I am pondering over.

I am sure I have posted a 75% line up in one of the threads here about a week ago.

 

[dante58701]

Do you have any plans for epic level fey? Such as faerie lords.

Speaking of which...how would you revise LeShay.

The Hoary Hunter would only require very minor tweaking (damage reduction and spell resistance primarily...and that weak little sword)...but other than the sword (could you advise me on the sword)...nothing really needs done with it.

Hoary Hunter...as it stands...what Challenge Rating/Level Adjustment would you give it?