Order of the Stick: Why isn't it going 4e?
Get a new baseless, intellectually dishonest complaint about the new edition, this one was used up in '99 whining about third edition.
Nahat Anoj
First Post
I think it's mostly because OotS is more about the story than it is about spoofing the rules. That's fine and all, but story beat out rules spoofs a while ago.
I was really hoping OotS would make the transition to 4e. My idea was that they would all revert to level 1, since WotC advised you should really try to convert characters, it's better to start from the beginning. This would have totally pissed off the characters
. Elan would have been a Warlord, totally (and how can anyone not laugh at the idea of Elan shouting "I'm a WARLORD!"). Varsuvius turning into an eladrin, Belkar growing to 4 feet tall, and a host of other weird little issues would have cropped up. And the fact that the Snarl was going strong at that point would have given a good, Spellplague-style justification to reboot the "rules."
I was really hoping OotS would make the transition to 4e. My idea was that they would all revert to level 1, since WotC advised you should really try to convert characters, it's better to start from the beginning. This would have totally pissed off the characters
. Elan would have been a Warlord, totally (and how can anyone not laugh at the idea of Elan shouting "I'm a WARLORD!"). Varsuvius turning into an eladrin, Belkar growing to 4 feet tall, and a host of other weird little issues would have cropped up. And the fact that the Snarl was going strong at that point would have given a good, Spellplague-style justification to reboot the "rules."I think one reason is that he's drawn a wider audience than just D&D players.
Another reason is that at the time, Bard and Barbarian didn't exist. And I wouldn't blame him for not wanting to change Haley to a 4e Rogue. I almost wouldn't blame him for not wanting to change Varsuvius into a 4e Wizard. At least, not until there are a lot more wizard powers available.
I don't think that things like "they already had paladins detecting evil, and 4e paladins don't detect evil" are valid reasons, though. The strip has repeatedly acknowledged abilities and game terminology from previous editions that no longer works. Wasn't that one elderly man they encountered a 1e fighter talking about things like THAC0?
Now that there is / will be a Bard playtest and there is a Barbarian playtest (although no multiclass feat), that isn't so much of an issue either.
So all that's left is that he's got readers that don't follow D&D and stylistic things like Haley the bow-using Rogue.
And there are benefits, as well: It helps to explain why Belkar doesn't use most of his 3e class features, for one. He wouldn't have a companion with Two-Weapon Fighting focus instead of Beast Mastery, and he could have chosen Dungeoneering instead of Nature, helping to explain why he sucks at tracking (moreso than his poor ability score.) Vaarsuvius wouldn't have to worry about remembering the familiar any more. Roy would be immensely more effective.
I'm almost disappointed that there aren't more rules jokes. The strip was funnier then. And it's not binary. There was a story when there were rules jokes, too. It's the same story.
The new "evolve or die" catchphrase is either telling of a change of heart, or unintentionally ironic.
It would be interesting to see the OotS fail in their main quest, only to have the Snarl reorder the universe as a 4e universe, and the Order have to pick up their quest all over again.
Another reason is that at the time, Bard and Barbarian didn't exist. And I wouldn't blame him for not wanting to change Haley to a 4e Rogue. I almost wouldn't blame him for not wanting to change Varsuvius into a 4e Wizard. At least, not until there are a lot more wizard powers available.
I don't think that things like "they already had paladins detecting evil, and 4e paladins don't detect evil" are valid reasons, though. The strip has repeatedly acknowledged abilities and game terminology from previous editions that no longer works. Wasn't that one elderly man they encountered a 1e fighter talking about things like THAC0?
Now that there is / will be a Bard playtest and there is a Barbarian playtest (although no multiclass feat), that isn't so much of an issue either.
So all that's left is that he's got readers that don't follow D&D and stylistic things like Haley the bow-using Rogue.
And there are benefits, as well: It helps to explain why Belkar doesn't use most of his 3e class features, for one. He wouldn't have a companion with Two-Weapon Fighting focus instead of Beast Mastery, and he could have chosen Dungeoneering instead of Nature, helping to explain why he sucks at tracking (moreso than his poor ability score.) Vaarsuvius wouldn't have to worry about remembering the familiar any more. Roy would be immensely more effective.
I'm almost disappointed that there aren't more rules jokes. The strip was funnier then. And it's not binary. There was a story when there were rules jokes, too. It's the same story.
The new "evolve or die" catchphrase is either telling of a change of heart, or unintentionally ironic.
It would be interesting to see the OotS fail in their main quest, only to have the Snarl reorder the universe as a 4e universe, and the Order have to pick up their quest all over again.
To each his/her own. For me, the increasing emphasis on story is why I've kept reading.
Lurks-no-More
First Post
Precisely. A comic that's nothing but jokes about the game would grow dull very quickly, and start repeating itself.
Evolve or die!
Mustrum_Ridcully
Hero
Why should he convert? What would he or the readers gain? It's not like when 4E came out we suddenly forgot everything about 3E and no longer have a frame of reference to appreciate any 3E rules-related humor.
More over, the rules focus of the joke is long gone. That's how OotS started, but it's not longer Rich or his readers primary concern. We want to know whether Roy returns to the living and finally gets to kick Xykons ass. We want to see the happy ending promised to Elan.
---
Aside from all this, well, Rich already said that he will mix 3E and 4E references if he finds it makes a good joke. (Bard Power Source in OotS 4E: Ignorance. Seems he got an early preview of PHB II, though it might not be up-to-date anymore
)---
And besides, 4E is so flawlessly designed that there is nothing to be joked about! *tries keeping a straight face*
Mustrum "Encountard and f4nboi" Ridcully
TwinBahamut
First Post
Mr. Burlew claimed that he was going to bring it over so that it was some vague gray area between 3.5E and 4E, but that certainly hasn't happened. Also, it is not like he has stopped making any jokes based on rules...
Seriously, in a very recent strip he turned the fairly obscure and very minor "can't sneak attack a rogue unless you are 4 levels higher" rule from 3.5E into a plot point within his strip. It was involved in a critical mistake on a character's part that lead directly to a fairly major event. Actually, that same comic had a punch-line/final quip that doesn't even make sense under 4E assumptions. No matter how much the strip is more focused on its own story than on rules jokes, it doesn't change the fact that D&D rules are a very important part of that story.
Also, Mr. Burlew continues to base all of the races, classes, and monsters in his strip on 3.5E races, classes, and monsters. He hasn't even made a single move to introduce a Warlord, or a Dragonborn, or one of the new 4E Angels, or anything.
I don't think a complete conversion is necessary at all, but right now Mr. Burlew seems to be doing nothing more than pretending that 4E doesn't even exist. He has certainly not held to his claim that he will make some kind of transition. If he just said outright that he was not going to make such a transition (like some other D&D based comic authors have made), then I would have no problem (other than a disagreement, I suppose, but one I could just ignore and keep to myself), but he did not go that route.
Seriously, in a very recent strip he turned the fairly obscure and very minor "can't sneak attack a rogue unless you are 4 levels higher" rule from 3.5E into a plot point within his strip. It was involved in a critical mistake on a character's part that lead directly to a fairly major event. Actually, that same comic had a punch-line/final quip that doesn't even make sense under 4E assumptions. No matter how much the strip is more focused on its own story than on rules jokes, it doesn't change the fact that D&D rules are a very important part of that story.
Also, Mr. Burlew continues to base all of the races, classes, and monsters in his strip on 3.5E races, classes, and monsters. He hasn't even made a single move to introduce a Warlord, or a Dragonborn, or one of the new 4E Angels, or anything.
I don't think a complete conversion is necessary at all, but right now Mr. Burlew seems to be doing nothing more than pretending that 4E doesn't even exist. He has certainly not held to his claim that he will make some kind of transition. If he just said outright that he was not going to make such a transition (like some other D&D based comic authors have made), then I would have no problem (other than a disagreement, I suppose, but one I could just ignore and keep to myself), but he did not go that route.
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