D&D 5E [poll] Sorcerer Satisfaction Survey

[CapnZapp]

Its fine, but having EE player guide, SCAG, and the XGE Help flesh it out giving new options.

I seem to recall the pertinent bits from EEPC and SCAG will be reprinted in XGtE... (?)

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[Tales and Chronicles]

I'd take a different spell list for sorcerers and I'd be ok. For now I allow my players to use the new spells from Kobold Press depending on their origin: Dragon Magic for dragon origin, Chaos for Wild, Celestial seals for Favored souls etc. It makes them feel like they really wield the power of their origin. Without this, I'd just play a warlock, which have least have some unique spells. To be honest, we had some new, sorcerer-only spells in one the the UA, so I think WotC will adress this issue someday.

 

[Mercule]

This is the first class I am dissatisfied with so far. Occasionally the sorcerer can do things the wizard can't, but it didn't feel different enough. But my biggest problems are the subclasses. Either be another version of a dragon-man (already have the dragonborn thanks), or a wild mage. I HATE wild mages. I totally get how not every class needs to appeal to every player. Heck, I've been preaching that myself. So I just ignore the class. But this poll is to give our opinions on every class. And I am not impressed with the sorcerer at all.

I agree almost 100% with your critiques, but I'm torn on whether to say "mostly satisfied/minor tweaks or mostly dissatisfied/major tweaks). Here's why:

When the PHB was first released, I looked at the Sorcerer and pitched the Wild Mage. That left only the dragon bloodline, which I don't like as the baseline for the class because it doesn't have a lot of range. So, after a bit of thought, I killed off the Sorcerer class, entirely, converting the dragon bloodline into a Great Wyrm Warlock patron and creating a Birthright pact that granted metamagic.

There's nothing really wrong with the dragon blooded subclass. I don't want every Sorcerer to be one, but that doesn't make it completely worthless. If you add in the various UA subclasses (favored soul, storm mage, etc.), things aren't too bad. I agree with the wild mage HATE (including all caps), though. They should have led with something else in the PHB and that's exactly what I'd do in a hypothetical reprint or 5.5: include the dragon blood, favored soul, and psionic (bear with me).

The biggest actual change I'd like to see to the Sorcerer is to adjust the fluff to all magic to make it clear that VSM are not universal: Wizards use precise formulae that can be repeated and controlled, Clerics pray to their patrons, Bards orate or play music, etc. As for Sorcerers, they're channeling pure magic from their bones. The VS components are just whatever feels right at the time, but don't actually do anything beyond help them focus. No two Sorcerers use exactly the same words and actions, and any individual Sorcerer may change things up depending on mood and circumstance. A fireball could involve shouting "Fuego!" and pointing -- or, it could be a guttural growl of "Burn, you bastard," accompanied by a creepy glare. With a bit of effort (i.e. metamagic), a Sorcerer can skip the crutch of the VS components, entirely.

Back to psionics.... I've got to run through the history of the Sorcerer, as I see it.

When the class was first introduced in 3E, there was a line about them being "born mages", with a throw-away bit about some getting their abilities from distant dragon ancestry manifesting. OK, whatever. My group ignored it and the people who played Sorcerers generally did it because they wanted to be mages without having to deal with daily preparation. The Sorcerer class got more spell slots than the Wizard but the trade-off was that they couldn't change what spells they knew. That was pretty much it, mechanically. I think there were a couple other differences, but none were particularly flavorful. In game, we seriously just said that Sorcerers were extremely focused Wizards, mastering a few spells to where they didn't need the books, but sacrificing the flexibility.

3.5 added more fluff about the dragon blood, but the mechanics were pretty much unchanged, so whatever. I remember 4E backing up the fluff with flavored mechanics, but the details escape me because we ran screaming from 4E after a few months.

Enter 5E. Wizards are much, much more flexible, now. They practically work like 3E Sorcerers who can change their "spells known" every day. The entire mechanical reason for introducing the Sorcerer is gone. So, we revisit the fluff:

Sorcerers are natural batteries of raw magical energy. They have some cute class abilities that reflect the various origins, but the way they cast spells/do magic doesn't really feel like they're dealing with raw magic. It feels like they intuitively know what Wizards spend years learning. If what Wizards do is something like physics or calculus (complex formulas, operations, and proofs), that means the Sorcerer is born with an instinctive understanding of calculus, which isn't outside the bounds of the genre, but seems a bit different than the fluff of raw magic power. They should be different. There's a huge benefit to the standardization of magical effects, though, so it makes sense to let them pull from the spell list rather than creating some new system to do exactly what a spell already does. Thus my "big tweak", above.

In 1E through 3E, the only way to get "wild powers" was to be psionic. In fact, 1E only had wild talents as psionics. There were few enough psionics that psychic combat wasn't particularly common, so psionics was just a cool spell-like ability or five. A lot of folks I gamed with explained psionics as "my father had an artifact and it screwed with him", "I spent time near a magical wasteland", or even "I have fiendish/celestial/dragon blood and this is how it manifested". Once the Psion class was introduced, those explanations kinda stuck, but characters who wanted to pursue that side of themselves could take the class. Yeah, the 3E class was a bit weird with that context, but it still worked.

So, if the Sorcerer now represents the "born like this", where does that leave the Psion? Even if you go whole hog on the Far Realm thing, that's just one more origin for the internal power source. Going with the idea of not reinventing the wheel for "spells" (powers look like a duck and quack like a duck), why create a whole new list of "spells" just because you want to call them "powers"? If the psionic points system is important, make the spell point system in the DMG a subclass feature of the psionic sorcerer, with sorcery points and spell points being transparently interchangeable.

With the existing material, even if you disagree about the Psion, my fix qualifies as pretty minor and, I think, redeems the class. But it took a while to get here.

So, far the PHB Sorcerer, my answer would be "extremely disappointed, major tweaks". But, I think most of the tweaks have actually been done. All that's needed is that last little bit of fluff, which is easy enough to house rule. Taking care of psionics is just a bonus.

 

[Triumph_Fork]

From what my players say: Tons of fun

Though some don't think the Sorcerer can compete with the Wizard in 5e, I'd have to disagree. I have a Lightning Draconic Sorcerer in the game I'm DMing and her character is extremely powerful. She has AC15 (without spells), she's extremely good at persuasion & Charisma checks which makes Sorcerers a GREAT party face/Diplomat in towns, and they have the ability to use meta-magic like Quicken spell for only a couple Sorcery Points. Personally, I find that really outshines the Wizard, especially since they can blast the same spells over and over. I find my player is having a fantastic time playing a Sorcerer.

 

[mrpopstar]

Dissatisfied.

There's truly nothing special about the sorcerer, and the concept appears to be a smattering of half-baked ideas.

My struggle is that I'm unsure exactly what I want from the class.

I think I want a bare-bones magic user who intuitively works with a chosen energy type in ways that leverage the benefits of metamagic, with percentage failure rates (decreasing as the character levels) that may result in wild magic effects, but another part of me thinks this might be far too simplistic for the fans who love the sorcerer.

I'm torn.

All I really know is that I have little desire to play one in their current incarnation.

 

[Dualazi]

Dissatisfied, bordering on very dissatisfied. This is one of the great letdowns of 5e, an overly curated spell list, terrible metamagic system that advances at a snail's pace, and no significant advantages on mileage as opposed to a wizard, which used to be one of their strengths. Subclasses are terrible to boot, with a functional but boring dragon themed subclass (I know dragons are in the title of the game, but seriously wizards, chill.), and another that's heavily dependent on DM fiat for effectiveness.

 

[Redthistle]

Rather unimportant, but my mind just tossed up a word-play for sorcerer: "Source-Error the Sorcerer."

I figure that if I ever create a modron sorcerer, that will be its name.

And Wild Magic would be its prime conundrum.

 

[Bitbrain]

Playing a 12th level Sorcerer, and he's a total badass.

Metamagic is fun and (to me anyway) makes the class feel like an innate spellcaster . . . Like their magic really is an extension of their body and soul.

I'm mostly satisfied with the sorcerer myself, about the only things I would change would be giving them Origin spells and have Sorcery Points recharge on short rest.

 

[Redthistle]

Playing a 12th level Sorcerer, and he's a total badass.

Metamagic is fun and (to me anyway) makes the class feel like an innate spellcaster . . . Like their magic really is an extension of their body and soul.

I'm mostly satisfied with the sorcerer myself, about the only things I would change would be giving them Origin spells and have Sorcery Points recharge on short rest.

I like the idea of Origin spells. Perhaps built on the innate racial spell-like abilities chassis: a cantrip at 1st level in the class, a 1st-level spell at Sorcerer level 1, and a 2nd-level spell at 3rd-level.

It opens the question, though: since the sorcerous origin is innate, should the character gain the spells independent of the class? I suppose it would be like developing a natural aptitude into a practiced skill: the character could only gain the spells when they are advancing/practicing in the sorcerer class.

Guess I answered my own question.

 

[Uchawi]

The Sorcerer suffers the same problem as the fighter, i.e. too generic.