D&D (2024) Poll: Will WOTC change the way cantrips scale for multiclass characters?

[LordEntrails]

Coupled with debloating hit points.

I think you recently mentioned this is another thread. I don't get it. You think PCs gain too many hit points as they level up? Are you more inclined to something like CON bonus only on level up?

 

[Stormonu]

I think you recently mentioned this is another thread. I don't get it. You think PCs gain too many hit points as they level up? Are you more inclined to something like CON bonus only on level up?

Yep, I'd pretty much like to go back towards AD&D 1 & 2E for hp. Hit dice up to 9th-10th level, and then 1 or 2 hit points (no Con bonus) after that. Personally, I'd also tune HD back - Wizards d4; Artificer, Bard, Rogue, Sorcerer, Warlock d6; Cleric, Monk d8; Fighter, Ranger, Paladin d10; Barbarian d12. Monster HD would go back to being around equal to CR or less. Spells might need some tweaks, as I'd certainly knock Fireball & Lightning bolt back down to 5d6 or so. Other sources of damage would have to be tuned as well, but mostly I'm to the point in my life that I want combat to be the side show that's over quickly to allow focus on the exploration and interaction more.

 

[MoonSong]

Yep, I'd pretty much like to go back towards AD&D 1 & 2E for hp. Hit dice up to 9th-10th level, and then 1 or 2 hit points (no Con bonus) after that. Personally, I'd also tune HD back - Wizards d4; Artificer, Bard, Rogue, Sorcerer, Warlock d6; Cleric, Monk d8; Fighter, Ranger, Paladin d10; Barbarian d12. Monster HD would go back to being around equal to CR or less. Spells might need some tweaks, as I'd certainly knock Fireball & Lightning bolt back down to 5d6 or so. Other sources of damage would have to be tuned as well, but mostly I'm to the point in my life that I want combat to be the side show that's over quickly to allow focus on the exploration and interaction more.

I'm thinking of Con score plus hit dice at first level, plus another hit dice at every tier of play (every fourth level) Sturdier first level characters, flimsier higher level characters. Of course, I'd have to recalibrate monsters and monster damage which is why I'm wary of trying it out.

 

[Distracted DM]

Yep, I'd pretty much like to go back towards AD&D 1 & 2E for hp. Hit dice up to 9th-10th level, and then 1 or 2 hit points (no Con bonus) after that. Personally, I'd also tune HD back - Wizards d4; Artificer, Bard, Rogue, Sorcerer, Warlock d6; Cleric, Monk d8; Fighter, Ranger, Paladin d10; Barbarian d12. Monster HD would go back to being around equal to CR or less. Spells might need some tweaks, as I'd certainly knock Fireball & Lightning bolt back down to 5d6 or so. Other sources of damage would have to be tuned as well, but mostly I'm to the point in my life that I want combat to be the side show that's over quickly to allow focus on the exploration and interaction more.

Have you ever played with an e6-ish idea? I made a rough draft for e9 a year or two back, but never playtested it.

 

[Horwath]

With spellcasters having leveled spells, I think cantrip spell scaling was a mistake. At best I think cantrip damage should scale at 11th level, and that's it.

why?

even with scaling casting a cantrip is a more or less waste of an action.

at 11th level you are using an action for dealing 10 damage with a firebolt on average?

while everyone else look at you at the table: really? that's the best you can do?

Coupled with debloating hit points.

This I agree 100%, HPs are too high later on.

Fireball damage is about right, other damage spells are bad, and upscaling damage spells is abysmal. Never do it.


only cantrip that does any decent damage is EB if warlock uses invocation, but, it's kid of 80% of that class, so it's OK.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

at 11th level you are using an action for dealing 10 damage with a firebolt on average?

16.5

 

[Horwath]

Have you ever played with an e6-ish idea? I made a rough draft for e9 a year or two back, but never playtested it.

I like the idea.

Casters get a single 5th level slots, nothing yet too world breaking.
halfcasters get to 3rd level.

maybe 10th level a break point so most classes get their subclass feature.

then every session or two just give a bonus feat for advancement. Or class level in another class, but without HPs

 

[Horwath]

16.5

60% expected hit rate, 16,5 ×0,6 = 9,9
10,7 if you include 5% crit chance

 

[Paul Farquhar]

60% expected hit rate, 16,5 ×0,6 = 9,9
10,7 if you include 5% crit chance

I think we can assume the caster will be using an attack roll cantrip when the hit chance is advantageous. They have plenty of other options for when it is not.

 

[Distracted DM]

Side note about the expected % hit rate in 5e- as characters advance in levels they gain bonuses to hit through higher stats, higher proficiency bonus (not including magic item +s).. but enemy ACs don't really rise to match them.