(Proposal) Learner Prestige Class

Rystil Arden

First Post
Anyway. Regarding the idea of having level restrictions - we've tried using that idea several times in the past, and it just doesn't seem to work. For one, new monsters will cause more work than they were intended to, because someone has to figure out level equivalencies for the creature's abilities (unless the creator does that, and they're supposed to anyway).

The list does exist already - it was written awhile ago. It is only lacking the true dragons (which are a major part of the learner, IMO), but once they're done, the entirety of the SRD is included in the list. Each ability has a spell level equivalency listed.

Ah, well the point of the list is that it needn't be all-inclusive. This way, you can just not put Quickness and Feed on the list, for instance. And you can just say that the new monsters aren't on the list either, for instance.
 

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GnomeWorks

Adventurer
The Learner, v6.3.3 (Approved prior to crash!)

Update to v.6.3.3
Self-Study clarified

Update to v6.3.2
Feats applied to talents (Empower Spell-Like Ability and Quicken Spell-Like Ability) are now restricted based on spell level and learner level.

Update to v6.3.1
Psionic monsters are now included in the lists.

Update to v6.3
Learners now have a list of monster abilities that can be learned.
The Observation ability now indicates situations in which it cannot be used.
Talents now have a minimum learner level to be used (they can still be learned at any time, however).
The equivalent spell level of a talent is now equal to the minimum learner level to use it.
The requirement of foci for certain talents is introduced and explained.
The prerequisites have been modified slightly to require 3rd-level arcane spells.

Update to v6.2
Learners now have a list of monster abilities that cannot be learned.
Learners cannot learn monster abilities of new monsters introduced in LEW, unless those abilities are approved for use in conjunction with the learner prestige class.

Update to v6.1
Metamagic feats can no longer be applied to talents.
A learner can now use monster feats that modify spell-like abilities.


ffta-h-bluemage.jpg

If image doesn't appear, picture is here (http://c-uncut.com/media/ffta-h-bluemage.jpg).

LEARNER
The profession of learner is perhaps one of the most eccentric ones available. Unlike any other group, the learners gain their abilities not from training or knowledge, but through directly experiencing them at the claws of monsters.

Though it is easy enough to define what it is that a learner does, it is not so easy to classify them as a group. Each learner has come across different monsters in their individual careers, leading to an array of abilities that are unique for each learner. Some learners are generalists, learning abilities from a wide variety of monsters, while others focus on a very small subset of creatures and emulate their abilities to the fullest, while still others most focus on a specific type of creature and learn abilities only from them. It is for this reason, as well, that trying to recruit a learner for a task is difficult and sometimes frustrating: you never know what you'll get.

As NPCs, learners are usually not encountered in peaceful settings. They are often found in the wilderness, hunting down and researching monsters.

Hit Die: d6.

REQUIREMENTS
To qualify to become a learner, a character must fulfill the following requirements.
BAB: +4.
Skills: Knowledge (arcana) 6 ranks, Knowledge (nature) 6 ranks.
Feats: Endurance.
Spells: Able to spontaneously cast at least 3rd-level arcane spells.

CLASS SKILLS
The learner’s class skills are Concentration (Con), Craft (Int), Handle Animal (Cha), Intimidate (Cha), Knowledge (Arcana) (Int), Knowledge (Dungeoneering) (Int), Knowledge (Nature) (Int), Knowledge (Religion), Knowlege (The Planes) (Int), Profession (Wis), Ride (Dex), Spot (Wis), Sense Motive (Wis), and Spellcraft (Int).

Skill Points at Each Additional Level: 4 + Intelligence modifier

Code:
[color=white][b]TABLE L-1: THE LEARNER

		Fort 	Will 	Ref
Lvl	BAB 	Save 	Save 	Save 	Special[/b]
1 	+0 	+0 	+2 	+0 	Observation, Lore, Self-Study
2 	+1 	+0 	+3 	+0 	Examine
3 	+2 	+1 	+3 	+1
4 	+3 	+1 	+4 	+1 	Conversion
5 	+3 	+1 	+4 	+1
6 	+4 	+2 	+5 	+2 	Analyze
7 	+5 	+2 	+5 	+2
8 	+6 	+2 	+6 	+2	Resistance
9 	+6 	+3 	+6 	+3
10	+7 	+3 	+7 	+3 	Continual Learning[/color]

CLASS FEATURES
All the following are class features of the learner prestige class.

Weapon and Armor Proficiency: Learners gain no new proficiencies.

When in light armor, a learner does not suffer from arcane spell failure when using her talents (see below).

Talents (Sp): Learners do not prepare or cast spells as more standard users of magic do. Instead, they utilize the abilities of monsters that they have learned through direct interaction with creatures; these abilities are known simply as talents. A learner can use any talent she knows at will (though she is limited to a set number per day), with the following qualifications:

A learner's talents are spell-like abilities, even if the ability they mimic are supernatural; using a talent is therefore at least a standard action (if the ability the talent was learned from took longer, then it takes that long instead) and provokes an attack of opportunity. A talent can be disrupted, just as a spell can be ruined during casting. A learner is entitled to a Concentration check to successfully use a talent if she is hit by an attack while concentrating, just as a spellcaster would be. A learner can choose to use a talent defensively, by making a successful Concentration check, to avoid provoking attacks of opportunity. A learner's talents are subject to spell resistance unless a talent's description specifically states otherwise. A learner's caster level with her talents is equal to her learner level + her caster level in her previous arcane spellcasting class (if she had more than one, she uses to meet the prerequisites of the learner class; if more than one fulfill this criteria, then she may choose which class to use). All of a learner's talents have an equivalent spell level equal the minimum learner level to use them.

The save DC for a talent (if it allows a save) is 10 + equivalent spell level + the learner's Charisma modifier. Since spell-like abilities are not spells, a learner cannot benefit from the Spell Focus feat. She can, however, benefit from the Ability Focus feat (note that the learner must choose a specific talent this feat applies to, rather than her talents as a whole). Also, she can learn the feats Empower Spell-Like Ability and Quicken Spell-Like Ability; when she takes one of these feats, she chooses one of her talents to apply them to. The learner must obey the restrictions on spell level regarding which talent she may choose (using her learner level as her caster level and the talent's effective spell level as its spell level), and retains the restriction on uses per day (she can only use the empowered or quickened version of the talent three times per day).

As the learner progresses, she gains the ability to learn more talents, as shown on Table L-2: Learner Talents.

A learner's talents work exactly as specified in the description of the monster ability. If the monster would require a specific item to use the ability, the learner must have that item to utilize the talent; the item works as a spell focus and is not consumed, unless otherwise stated in the monster ability's description. All talents also have a somatic component, and some may have a verbal component dependent on the talent in question (usually specified in the monster ability's description). If the ability does not have a duration listed, or is a continuous ability, the learner's talent lasts for 1 round/learner level.

To use a talent, the learner has only to expend a single use of her talents/day. This is true for any talent she knows.

A learner can only use talents whose minimum learner level she meets. She can still learn any ability on the learner ability list (see below), but she cannot use an ability without having the minimum learner level listed.

In addition, certain talents require a focus; these abilities make note of a specific item the creature the ability was learned from must have, and the learner must attain the noted item from the creature the ability was learned from. The item does not have to necessarily be taken from that specific creature, but it must be a creature of the same kind (for example, to use a trumpet archon's trumpet ability, a learner must have a trumpet archon's trumpet).

Note that a learner can only learn talents from monster abilities that are inherent. An ability gained from class levels or feats cannot be learned as a talent. An ability that is part of a set of abilities listed under "Spell-like Abilities" cannot be learned; only abilities listed as "Ability Name (Sp or Su)" can be learned. Multiple abilities listed under (Su) can be learned, however.

Finally, unlike other spell-like abilities, talents are subject to arcane spell failure.

Code:
[color=white][b]TABLE L-2: LEARNER TALENTS

Lvl 	Talents/Day 	Talents Known[/b]
1 	2 + Wis mod 	3 + Int mod
2 	3 + Wis mod 	5 + Int mod
3 	5 + Wis mod 	7 + Int mod
4 	6 + Wis mod 	9 + Int mod
5 	8 + Wis mod 	11 + Int mod
6 	9 + Wis mod 	13 + Int mod
7 	10 + Wis mod 	15 + Int mod
8 	12 + Wis mod 	17 + Int mod
9 	13 + Wis mod 	19 + Int mod
10 	15 + Wis mod 	21 + Int mod[/color]

Restricted Talents: Not all monster abilities can be used as talents - the energy used by the creature is too foreign even for a learner to replicate, or learners have yet to formulate methodology to deal with a new creature's abilities. As such, learners cannot learn the following monster abilities as talents.

TABLE L-3: RESTRICTED TALENTS
[sblock]
Code:
[color=white][b]TABLE L-3: RESTRICTED TALENTS

Monster 	Ability[/b]
Barghest 	Feed
Choker 		Quickness
Demon
--Vrock 	Dance of Ruin
Devourer 	Trap Essence
		Spell Deflection
Ghost 		Rejuvenation
Mohrg 		Create Spawn
Nightshade
--Nightcrawler 	Summon Undead
--Nightwalker 	Summon Undead
--Nightwing 	Summon Undead
Shadow 		Create Spawn
Shocker Lizard 	Stunning Shock
Spectre 	Create Spawn
Vampire 	Create Spawn
Wight 		Create Spawn[/color]
[/sblock]
TABLE L-4: RESTRICTED TALENTS - PSIONIC CREATURES[sblock]
Code:
[color=white][b]TABLE L-4: RESTRICTED TALENTS - PSIONIC CREATURES

Monster 		Ability[/b]
Caller in Darkness 	Steal Essence
Cerebrilith 		Summon Demon
Intellect 		Devourer Body Thief[/color]
[/sblock]
In addition, a learner can only learn abilities from monsters from the SRD, and cannot learn abilities from a monster introduced in a Proposal thread in LEW unless the ability is approved for use in conjunction with the learner prestige class.

The following lists are abilities that a learner can learn as talents.

TABLE L-5: LEARNER TALENT LIST[sblock]
Code:
[color=white][b]TABLE L-0: LEARNABLE ABILITY LIST
								Minimum
Creature		Ability	(Type) 				Learner Level	Focus[/b]
Allip			Babble (Su) 				2nd
			Madness (Su)				1st
			Wisdom Drain (Su)			1st
Angel
--Astral Deva		Stun (Su) 				2nd		Astral Deva's Mace
Aranea			Change Shape (Su)			4th
Archon			Aura of Menace (Su)			2nd
			Magic Circle Against Evil (Su)		3rd
			Teleport (Su)				7th
			Tongues (Su)				3rd
--Hound			Change Shape (Su)			4th
--Trumpet		Trumpet (Su)				5th		Trumpet Archon's Horn
Arrowhawk		
--Juvenile		Electricity Ray (Su)			2nd
--Adult			Electricity Ray (Su)			3rd
Assassin Vine		Entangle (Su)				1st
Barghest		Change Shape (Su)			4th
Basilisk		Petrifying Gaze (Su)			5th
Behir			Breath Weapon (Su)			8th
Belker			Smoke Form (Su)				3rd
Blink Dog		Blink (Su)				3rd
			Dimension Door (Su)			4th
Bodak			Death Gaze (Su)				7th
Celestial		Smite Evil (Su)				2nd
Chaos Beast		Corporeal Instability (Su)		7th
Chimera			Breath Weapon (Su)			3rd
Cloaker			Shadow Shift (Su)			4th
Cockatrice		Petrification (Su)			5th
Couatl			Ethereal Jaunt (Su)			7th
			Telepathy (Su)				3rd
Darkmantle		Darkness (Su)				2nd
Demon								
--Babau			Protective Slime (Su)			5th
--Balor			Flaming Body (Su)			8th
--Bebilith		Plane Shift (Su)			7th
--Dretch		Telepathy (Su)				2nd
--Glabrezu		True Seeing (Su)			6th
--Marilith		True Seeing (Su)			6th
--Nalfeshnee		Smite (Su)				6th
			True Seeing (Su)			6th
--Quasit		Alternate Form (Su)			3rd
--Retriever		Eye Ray: Fire (Su)			6th
			Eye Ray: Cold (Su)			6th
			Eye Ray: Electricity (Su)		6th
			Eye Ray: Petrification (Su)		5th
			Find Target (Sp)			8th
--Succubus		Energy Drain (Su)			3rd
			Tongues (Su)				3rd
--Vrock			Stunning Screech (Su)			2nd
Destrachan		Destructive Harmonics (Su)		4th
Devil			See in Darkness (Su)			3rd
			Telepathy (Su)				2nd
--Barbed		Fear (Su)				4th
			Barbed Defense (Su)			2nd
--Bearded		Infernal Wound (Su)			3rd
--Bone			Fear Aura (Su)				4th
--Chain			Dancing Chains (Su)			5th
			Unnerving Gaze (Su)			2nd
--Erinyes		True Seeing (Su)			6th
--Horned		Fear Aura (Su)				4th
			Stun (Su)				2nd
			Infernal Wound (Su)			3rd
--Ice			Fear Aura (Su)				4th
			Slow (Su)				3rd
--Imp			Alternate Form (Su)			3rd
--Pit Fiend		Disease (Su)				4th
			Fear Aura (Su)				5th
Devourer		Energy Drain (Su)			3rd
Displacer Beast		Displacement (Su)			4th
			Resist Ranged Attacks (Su)		1st
Doppelganger		Detect Thoughts (Su)			4th
			Change Shape (Su)			4th
Dragon Turtle		Breath Weapon (Su)			4th
Dragonne		Roar (Su)				2nd
Elemental (Air)		
--Small			Whirlwind (Su)				1st
--Medium		Whirlwind (Su)				3rd
--Large			Whirlwind (Su)				5th
--Huge			Whirlwind (Su)				7th
Elemental (Water)	
--Small			Vortex (Su)				1st
--Medium		Vortex (Su)				3rd
--Large			Vortex (Su)				5th
--Huge			Vortex (Su)				7th
Ethereal Filcher	Detect Magic (Su)			1st
			Ethereal Jaunt (Su)			7th
Ethereal Marauder	Ethereal Jaunt (Su)			7th
Fiendish		Smite Good (Su)				2nd
Formian								
--Worker		Cure Serious Wounds (Sp)		3rd
			Make Whole (Sp)				2nd
--Taskmaster		Dominate Monster (Su)			9th
--Queen			Telepathy (Su)				2nd
Frost Worm		Trill (Su)				2nd
			Breath Weapon (Su)			5th
Genie			Plane Shift [Limited] (Su)		7th
--Djinn			Whirlwind (Su)				5th
--Noble Djinn		Wish (Sp)				10th
--Efreet		Change Size (Su)			2nd
--Janni			Change Size (Su)			2nd
Gaele			Gaze (Su)				5th
			Alternate Form (Su)			7th
			Protective Aura (Su)			5th
			Tongues (Su)				3rd
Ghost			Corrupting Gaze (Su)			5th
			Corrupting Touch (Su)			1st
			Draining Touch (Su)			4th
			Frightful Moan (Su)			3rd
			Horrific Appearance (Su)		5th
			Malevolence (Su)			6th
			Manifestation (Su)			3rd
			Telekinesis (Su)			5th
Ghoul			Ghoul Fever (Su)			3rd
Gibbering Mouther	Gibbering (Su)				4th
			Ground Manipulation (Su)		1st
Golem (Clay)		Haste (Su)				3rd
Golem (Stone)		Slow (Su)				3rd
Gorgon			Breath Weapon (Su)			7th
Hag (Green)		Weakness (Su)				5th
Hag (Sea)		Horrific Appearance (Su)		5th
			Evil Eye (Su)				5th
Half-Celestial		Daylight (Su)				3rd
			Smite Evil (Su)				2nd
Half-Dragon		Breath Weapon (Su)			3rd
Half-Fiend		Smite Good (Su)				2nd
Harpy			Captivating Song (Su)			4th
Hell Hound		Breath Weapon (Su)			2nd
			Fiery Bite (Su)				1st
Inevitables							
--Kolyarut		Enervation Ray (Su)			4th
			Vampiric Touch (Su)			3rd
--Marut			Fists of Thunder and Lightning (Su)	5th
Invisible Stalker	Natural Invisibility (Su)		4th
Krenshar		Scare (Su)				2nd
Lamia			Wisdom Drain (Su)			3rd
Lamasu			Magic Circle Against Evil (Su)		3rd
Leonal			Roar (Su)				7th
			Lay on Hands (Su)			6th
			Protective Aura (Su)			5th
			Speak with Animals (Su)			1st
Lich			Fear Aura (Su)				3rd
			Paralyzing Touch (Su)			6th
			Damage Reduction (Su)			4th
Lycanthrope		Alternate Form (Su)			3rd
			Curse of Lycanthropy (Su)		4th
Medusa			Petrifying Gaze (Su)			7th
Mephit								
--Air			Breath Weapon (Su)			2nd
--Dust			Breath Weapon (Su)			2nd
--Earth			Breath Weapon (Su)			2nd
			Change Size (Su)			2nd
--Fire			Breath Weapon (Su)			2nd
--Ice			Breath Weapon (Su)			2nd
--Magma			Breath Weapon (Su)			2nd
--Ooze			Breath Weapon (Su)			2nd
--Salt			Breath Weapon (Su)			2nd
--Steam			Breath Weapon (Su)			2nd
--Water			Breath Weapon (Su)			2nd
Mohrg			Paralyzing Touch (Su)			4th
Mummy			Despair (Su)				4th
			Mummy Rot (Su)				6th
Naga								
--Dark Naga		Detect Thoughts (Su)			2nd
--Spirit Naga		Charming Gaze (Su)			3rd
Night Hag		Dream Haunting (Su)			9th		Night Hag's Heartstone
Nightmare		Flaming Hooves (Su)			1st
			Smoke (Su)				1st
			Etherealness (Su)			9th
			Astral Projection (Su)			10th
Nightshade		Desecrating Aura (Su)			3rd
--Nightcrawler		Energy Drain (Su)			4th
--Nightwalker		Crush Item (Su)				2nd
			Evil Gaze (Su)				4th
--Nightwing		Magic Drain (Su)			6th
Nymph			Blinding Beauty (Su)			5th
			Stunning Glance (Su)			3rd
			Unearthly Grace (Su)			2nd
Ogre Mage		Flight (Su)				3rd
Phantom Fungus		Greater Invisibility (Su)		4th
Phase Spider		Ethereal Jaunt (Su)			7th
Phasm			Alternate Form (Su)			4th
Planetouched							
--Aasimar		Daylight (Sp)				3rd
--Tiefling		Darkness (Sp)				2nd
Pseudodragon		Telepathy (Su)				5th
Rakshasa		Detect Thoughts (Su)			2nd
			Change Form (Su)			2nd
Rast			Paralyzing Gaze (Su)			4th
			Flight (Su)				3rd
Ravid			Positive Energy Lash (Su)		3rd
			Animate Objects (Su)			6th
			Flight (Su)				3rd
Satyr			Pipes (Su)				4th		Satyr's Pipes
Shadow			Strength Damage (Su)			2nd
Shadow Mastiff		Bay (Su)				6th
			Shadow Blend (Su)			3rd
Shield Guardian		Find Master (Su)			2nd		Shield Guardian's Amulet
			Shield Other (Sp)			2nd		Shield Guardian's Amulet
			Spell Storing (Sp)			4th
Shocker Lizard		Lethal Shock (Su)			3rd
Spectre			Energy Drain (Su)			4th
			Unnatural Aura (Su)			2nd
Sphinx								
--Androsphinx		Roar (Su)				7th
Spider Eater		Freedom of Movement (Su)		4th
Sprite								
--Grig			Fiddle (Su)				6th		Grig's Fiddle
--Nixie			Charm Person (Sp)			1st
			Water Breathing (Sp)			3rd
--Pixie			Greater Invisibility (Su)		4th
Tarrasque		Frightful Presence (Su)			4th
Treant			Animate Trees (Sp)			6th
Umber Hulk		Confusing Gaze (Sp)			4th
Unicorn			Magic Circle Against Evil (Su)		3rd
Vampire			Children of the Night (Su)		2nd
			Dominate (Su)				5th
			Energy Drain (Su)			5th
			Alternate Form (Su)			4th
			Damage Reduction (Su)			4th
			Gaseous Form (Su)			3rd
Vampire Spawn		Domination (Su)				5th
			Energy Drain (Su)			4th
			Gaseous Form (Su)			3rd
Vargouille		Shriek (Su)				6th
			Kiss (Su)				6th
Wight			Energy Drain (Su)			4th
Winter Wolf		Breath Weapon (Su)			3rd
			Freezing Bite (Su)			2nd
Wraith			Unnatural Aura (Su)			1st
			Constitution Drain (Su)			4th
--Dread			Lifesense (Su)				3rd
			Constitution Drain (Su)			5th
Xill			Planewalk (Su)				7th
Yeth Hound		Bay (Su)				2nd
			Flight (Su)				4th
Yrthak			Sonic Lance (Su)			4th
Yuan-ti								
--Halfblood		Produce Acid (Sp)			2nd
			Chameleon Power (Sp)			1st
--Abomination		Aversion (Sp)				6th
			Produce Acid (Sp)			2nd
			Chameleon Power (Sp)			1st[/color]
[/sblock]
Abilities of true dragons may be dependent upon their age category or set their saving throw DCs based upon their Frightful Presence DC. When a learner uses a talent learned from a true dragon, use her learner level as her age category, and set the saving throws of abilities that reference the dragon's Frightful Presence using the normal method of setting an ability's saving throw DC (10 + talent's spell level + learner's Cha modifier).

For dragons, all references to frightful presence are ignored; the DCs set by these abilities are set just as they are for other talents.

TABLE L-6: LEARNER TALENT LIST - TRUE DRAGONS[sblock]
Code:
[color=white][b]TABLE L-6: LEARNABLE ABILITY LIST - TRUE DRAGONS

							Minimum
Creature	Ability	(Type) 				Learner Level	Focus[/b]
Black Dragon		
--Wyrmling	Breath Weapon (Su)			1st
--Very Young	Breath Weapon (Su)			2nd
--Young		Breath Weapon (Su)			3rd
--Juvenile	Breath Weapon (Su)			4th
		Darkness (Sp)				3rd
--Young Adult	Breath Weapon (Su)			5th
--Adult		Breath Weapon (Su)			6th
		Corrupt Water (Sp)			1st
--Mature Adult	Breath Weapon (Su)			7th
--Old		Breath Weapon (Su)			8th
		Plant Growth (Sp)			3rd
--Very Old	Breath Weapon (Su)			9th
--Ancient	Breath Weapon (Su)			10th
		Insect Plague (Sp)			5th
--Wyrm		Breath Weapon (Su)			10th
--Great Wyrm	Breath Weapon (Su)			10th
		Charm Reptiles (Sp)			2nd

Blue Dragon	Create/Destroy Water (Sp)		1st
--Wyrmling	Breath Weapon (Su)			1st
--Very Young	Breath Weapon (Su)			2nd
--Young		Breath Weapon (Su)			3rd
--Juvenile	Breath Weapon (Su)			4th
--Young Adult	Breath Weapon (Su)			5th
--Adult		Breath Weapon (Su)			6th
		Ventriloquism (Sp)			1st
--Mature Adult	Breath Weapon (Su)			7th
--Old		Breath Weapon (Su)			8th
		Hallucinatory Terrain (Sp)		4th
--Very Old	Breath Weapon (Su)			9th
--Ancient	Breath Weapon (Su)			10th
		Veil (Sp)				6th
--Wyrm		Breath Weapon (Su)			10th
--Great Wyrm	Breath Weapon (Su)			10th
		Mirage Arcana (Sp)			5th

Green Dragon							
--Wyrmling	Breath Weapon (Su)			1st
--Very Young	Breath Weapon (Su)			2nd
--Young		Breath Weapon (Su)			3rd
--Juvenile	Breath Weapon (Su)			4th
--Young Adult	Breath Weapon (Su)			5th
--Adult		Breath Weapon (Su)			6th
		Suggestion (Sp)				3rd
--Mature Adult	Breath Weapon (Su)			7th
--Old		Breath Weapon (Su)			8th
		Plant Growth (Sp)			3rd
--Very Old	Breath Weapon (Su)			9th
--Ancient	Breath Weapon (Su)			10th
		Dominate Person (Sp)			5th
--Wyrm		Breath Weapon (Su)			10th
--Great Wyrm	Breath Weapon (Su)			10th

Red Dragon							
--Wyrmling	Breath Weapon (Su)			1st
--Very Young	Breath Weapon (Su)			2nd
--Young		Breath Weapon (Su)			3rd
--Juvenile	Breath Weapon (Su)			4th
		Locate Object (Sp)			2nd
--Young Adult	Breath Weapon (Su)			5th
--Adult		Breath Weapon (Su)			6th
--Mature Adult	Breath Weapon (Su)			7th
--Old		Breath Weapon (Su)			8th
		Suggestion (Sp)				3rd
--Very Old	Breath Weapon (Su)			9th
--Ancient	Breath Weapon (Su)			10th
		Find the Path (Sp)			6th
--Wyrm		Breath Weapon (Su)			10th
--Great Wyrm	Breath Weapon (Su)			10th
		Discern Location (Sp)			8th

White Dragon							
--Wyrmling	Breath Weapon (Su)			1st
--Very Young	Breath Weapon (Su)			2nd
--Young		Breath Weapon (Su)			3rd
--Juvenile	Breath Weapon (Su)			4th
		Fog Cloud (Sp)				2nd
--Young Adult	Breath Weapon (Su)			5th
--Adult		Breath Weapon (Su)			6th
		Gust of Wind (Sp)			2nd
--Mature Adult	Breath Weapon (Su)			7th
--Old		Breath Weapon (Su)			8th
		Freezing Fog (Sp)			4th
--Very Old	Breath Weapon (Su)			9th
--Ancient	Breath Weapon (Su)			10th
		Wall of Ice (Sp)			4th
--Wyrm		Breath Weapon (Su)			10th
--Great Wyrm	Breath Weapon (Su)			10th
		Control Weather (Sp)			7th

Bronze Dragon	Speak with Animals (Sp)			2nd
--Wyrmling	Breath Weapon (Su)			1st
--Very Young	Breath Weapon (Su)			2nd
--Young		Breath Weapon (Su)			3rd
--Juvenile	Breath Weapon (Su)			4th
		Endure Elements (Sp)			1st
--Young Adult	Breath Weapon (Su)			5th
--Adult		Breath Weapon (Su)			6th
		Suggestion (Sp)				3rd
--Mature Adult	Breath Weapon (Su)			7th
--Old		Breath Weapon (Su)			8th
		Control Winds (Sp)			5th
--Very Old	Breath Weapon (Su)			9th
--Ancient	Breath Weapon (Su)			10th
		Control Weather (Sp)			7th
--Wyrm		Breath Weapon (Su)			10th
--Great Wyrm	Breath Weapon (Su)			10th
		Summon Djinni (Sp)			9th

Brass Dragon	Speak with Animals (Sp)			2nd
--Wyrmling	Breath Weapon (Su)			1st
--Very Young	Breath Weapon (Su)			2nd
--Young		Breath Weapon (Su)			3rd
		Alternate Form (Su)			4th
--Juvenile	Breath Weapon (Su)			4th
--Young Adult	Breath Weapon (Su)			5th
--Adult		Breath Weapon (Su)			6th
		Create Food and Water (Sp)		3rd
		Fog Cloud (Sp)				2nd
--Mature Adult	Breath Weapon (Su)			7th
--Old		Breath Weapon (Su)			8th
		Detect Thoughts (Sp)			2nd
--Very Old	Breath Weapon (Su)			9th
--Ancient	Breath Weapon (Su)			10th
		Control Water (Sp)			4th
--Wyrm		Breath Weapon (Su)			10th
--Great Wyrm	Breath Weapon (Su)			10th
		Control Weather (Sp)			7th

Copper Dragon		
--Wyrmling	Breath Weapon (Su)			1st
--Very Young	Breath Weapon (Su)			2nd
--Young		Breath Weapon (Su)			3rd
--Juvenile	Breath Weapon (Su)			4th
--Young Adult	Breath Weapon (Su)			5th
--Adult		Breath Weapon (Su)			6th
		Stone Shape (Sp)			3rd
--Mature Adult	Breath Weapon (Su)			7th
--Old		Breath Weapon (Su)			8th
		Transmute Rock to Mud/Mud to Rock (Sp)	5th
--Very Old	Breath Weapon (Su)			9th
--Ancient	Breath Weapon (Su)			10th
		Wall of Stone (Sp)			5th
--Wyrm		Breath Weapon (Su)			10th
--Great Wyrm	Breath Weapon (Su)			10th
		Move Earth (Sp)				6th

Gold Dragon	Alternate Form (Su)			4th
--Wyrmling	Breath Weapon (Su)			1st
--Very Young	Breath Weapon (Su)			2nd
--Young		Breath Weapon (Su)			3rd
--Juvenile	Breath Weapon (Su)			4th
		Bless (Sp)				1st
--Young Adult	Breath Weapon (Su)			5th
--Adult		Breath Weapon (Su)			6th
		Luck Bonus (Sp)				2nd
--Mature Adult	Breath Weapon (Su)			7th
--Old		Breath Weapon (Su)			8th
		Geas/Quest (Sp)				7th
		Detect Gems (Sp)			2nd
--Very Old	Breath Weapon (Su)			9th
--Ancient	Breath Weapon (Su)			10th
		Sunburst (Sp)				8th
--Wyrm		Breath Weapon (Su)			10th
--Great Wyrm	Breath Weapon (Su)			10th
		Foresight (Sp)				9th

Silver Dragon	Alternate Form (Su)			4th
		Cloudwalking (Su)			6th
--Wyrmling	Breath Weapon (Su)			1st
--Very Young	Breath Weapon (Su)			2nd
--Young		Breath Weapon (Su)			3rd
--Juvenile	Breath Weapon (Su)			4th
		Feather Fall (Sp)			1st
--Young Adult	Breath Weapon (Su)			5th
--Adult		Breath Weapon (Su)			6th
		Fog Cloud (Sp)				2nd
--Mature Adult	Breath Weapon (Su)			7th
--Old		Breath Weapon (Su)			8th
		Control Winds (Sp)			5th
--Very Old	Breath Weapon (Su)			9th
--Ancient	Breath Weapon (Su)			10th
		Control Weather (Sp)			7th
--Wyrm		Breath Weapon (Su)			10th
--Great Wyrm	Breath Weapon (Su)			10th
		Reverse Gravity (Sp)			7th[/color]
[/sblock]
The abilities of some psionic creatures may mention the expenditure of psionic power points; a learner may ignore such requirements.

TABLE L-7: LEARNER TALENT LIST - PSIONIC CREATURES[sblock]
Code:
[color=white][b]TABLE L-7: LEARNER TALENT LIST - PSIONIC CREATURES

							Minimum
Creature		Ability (Type)			Learner Level	[/b]
Astral Construct	Smite (Su)			1st
			Concussion (Ps)			4th
			Dimension Slide (Ps)		3rd
			Energy Bolt (Ps)		5th
			Natural Invisibility (Su)	4th	
Brain Mole		Hide Mind (Su)			1st
			Power Conversion (Su)		2nd
Caller in Darkness	Unnatural Aura (Su)		2nd
Elan			Repletion (Su)			3rd
			Resilience (Su)			2nd
			Resistance (Su)			1st
Gray Glutton		Null Psionic Exhalation (Su)	4th	
Neothelid		Breath Weapon (Su)		7th
Psion-Killer		Dispel Psionics (Su)		3rd
Puppeteer		Hide Mind (Su)			1st
			Telepathy (Su)			4th
Temporal Filcher	Time Filch (Su)			5th
Thought Eater		Eat Thoughts (Su)		3rd
			Ethereal Jaunt (Su)		7th
Thought Slayer		Mind Consuming Gaze (Su)	6th
			Ethereal Jaunt (Su)		7th
Unbodied		Telekinetic Force (Su)		3rd
			Assume Likeness (Su)		3rd
			Hide Mind (Su)			1st
Xeph			Burst (Su)			1st[/color]
[/sblock]
Observation (Su): The primary way that a learner learns her talents is through observation. As a standard action, a learner can watch monsters present within 60 feet. If any of them should use an Su or Sp ability until the learner’s next action, the learner may attempt to learn the talent associated with that ability.

In order to learn the talent, the learner must make a Knowledge check against the Su or Sp ability’s saving throw DC. If it doesn’t have one, the DC to learn the ability is 10 + one-half the monster’s HD + the monster’s Charisma modifier (if the modifier is less than +0, it is considered +0 for purposes of learning). If the learner succeeds, she learns the talent associated with that ability, so long as she has not learned her maximum number of talents.

The specific Knowledge check depends upon the type of the monster the ability is being learned from.
Code:
[color=white][b]TABLE L-8: KNOWLEDGE SKILLS USED FOR OBSERVATION

Knowledge (...) 	Monster Types[/b]
Arcana 			constructs, dragons, magical beasts
Dungeoneering 		aberrations, oozes
Nature 			animals, fey, giants, humanoids, monstrous humanoids,
			plants, vermin
Religion 		undead
The Planes 		elementals, outsiders[/color]
If he does not have an available talent slot, she can still learn the talent, though she must switch out a talent she already knows to do so. The learner can do this as a move action; however, she must choose to do so within a number of rounds after she would have normally learned the talent equal to her Wisdom modifier. The learner permanently loses the swapped-out talent, but she can attempt to relearn it normally.

Example: A learner with a Wisdom of 14 has no open talent slots, and is subjected to a basilisk's gaze. Surviving, she wants to try to learn the talent. To do so, she must take a move action within 2 rounds of being subjected to the basilisk's gaze to learn that talent, and she must lose another talent to make room for the new one.

If the learner fails, she does not learn the talent. However, the next time she attempts to learn that talent in the same combat, she gets a +1 competence bonus on her Knowledge check to learn the talent for each time she has failed.

If the learner is attacked with an Su or Sp ability while observing, she gets a +4 bonus on the Knowledge check to learn that talent.

Observation requires that the learner have a line of effect and line of sight to the creature being observed. If the ability also has a vocal or sonic component, the learner must also be able to clearly hear the creature.

Lore: Learners are well-versed in the nature of monstrosities. As such, she may make a special knowledge check with a bonus equal to her learner level + her Intelligence modifier to see whether she knows some relevant information concerning a monster or learner talent.
Code:
[color=white][b]TABLE L-9: LEARNER LORE

DC 	Type of Knowledge Examples[/b]
10 	Common, known by at least a The weaknesses of lycanthropes; more
	substantial minority of the local common learner talents.
	population.
20 	Uncommon but available, known The names of specific types of angels
	by only a few people in the area. and eladrins; unusual learner talents.
25 	Obscure, known by few, hard to The history of a race of monsters;
	come by. powerful learner talents.
30 	Extremely obscure, known by The history of an ancient, lost race;
	very few. talents learned from extinct species.[/color]
A successful lore check will not reveal the powers of a magic item related to learner talents but may given a hint as to its general function. A learner may not take 10 or take 20 on this check; this sort of knowledge is essentially random.

A learner can make a Lore check to determine what learner talents can be learned from a given monster; the DC is equal to 10 + the monster’s HD.

Self-Study: At first level, the learner may choose one of her spells known from one of her previous arcane spellcasting class. The spell chosen can be of a spell level up to one less than her maximum spell level known for that class.

The spell chosen permanently becomes one of the learner's talents, and she loses the spell from her spells known for the class she took it from (the spell cannot be replaced until she gains a level in that class that would allow her to switch out spells, at which point she may choose to gain a new spell in place of the lost spell known).

The talent gained this way has a minimum learner level equal to its equivalent spell level.

If the learner switches out the talent she learns in this manner in order to learn a new talent, she may later spend an hour in meditation to relearn it at any time. However, if she has no available talents known, she must switch out another talent, just as though she were learning the talent normally (see Observation, above).

Examine (Ex): At 2nd level, the learner gains the ability to judge an opponent’s or monster’s capabilities. As a standard action, the learner makes a Lore check, opposed by the opponent's Will save. If the learner succeeds, she determines the target’s current hit points, creature type, and what will penetrate its DR (if any). If the learner fails, she cannot attempt to use this ability on that opponent again for the rest of that day.

Effects that prevent the creature from being scryed also prevent the learner from using Examine on it.

Conversion (Su): At 4th level, the learner has mastered the art of converting her arcane energy into a shield to enable her to survive the abilities of monsters. In effect, she gains a DR equal to her Wisdom modifier. Each time this DR prevents damage, she loses one use of a talent. Each time she is dealt damage, the learner chooses whether or not to activate this ability.

A learner suffers no adverse effects from losing talent slots in this way.

Analyze (Ex): At 6th level, the learner has become adept at judging her opponents and monsters. As a standard action, the learner makes a Lore check, opposed by the opponent's Will save. If the learner succeeds, she determines the target’s current and max hit points, creature type and subtypes, how powerful its DR is and what will penetrate it (if any), and any immunities or vulnerabilities it has (if any). If the learner fails, she cannot attempt to use this ability or Examine on that opponent again for the rest of that day.

Effects that prevent the creature from being scryed also prevent the learner from using Analyze on it.

Resistance (Ex): At eighth level, the learner begins to become more resistant to conditions that would impede him and his ability to learn. He gains a +2 resistance bonus on saving throws against effects that would cause the following conditions: ability damage, blinded, confused, dazed, dazzled, deafened, diseased, exhausted, fatigued, feebleminded, insanity, nauseated, sickened, stunned, and poisoned.

Continual Observation (Su): At 10th level, the learner has mastered the art of being continually alert. She is now considered observing at all times, and she does not need to take a standard action to observe; however, the maximum range for continual observation is 5 feet/2 learner levels.

The learner can still observe as a standard action.
 


GnomeWorks

Adventurer
Sorry to commit thread necromancy here, but I came across something interesting while rereading the Learner description.

SRD (Elan description)
Resilience (Su): As an immediate action, an elan can reduce the damage he is about to take by 2 points for every 1 power point spent.

Learners ignore power point expenditures. Obviously, this leads to a problem.

My immediate reaction is to add a clause to the description before the psionic powers, stating that any ability that is based on number of power points expended is treated as though it were used using the minimum power points, with the ability to expend additional talent slots that are treated as the minimum again.

Example - for Resilience, a talent slot is treated as 1 PP for the purposes of the ability; the learner may then expend any number of additional talent slots, each of which is treated as 1 PP as far as Resilience is concerned.

Exact wording would be: "The abilities of some psionic creatures may mention the expenditure of psionic power points; a learner may ignore such requirements, treating the talent slot expended as replacing the power point expenditure. If the ability allows for spending more power points to produce more effect, then the learner may expend additional talent slots, each of which is equivalent to the number of power points required for each increase in effect, to a maximum of his learner level."

The cap on the number of talent slots expended is meant to mimic the metapsionic cap and also to restrict the abilities in some fashion; in the case of resilience, it could get absurd with the amount of damage the learner could ignore.

Anyone have a problem with this fix?
 

Erekose13

Explorer
I'd rather see it that Learners would have to expend the power points when they learn this ability, meaning that they would have to have a power point pool to take advantage of it. That way there are no additional rules for this one ability.
 

Rystil Arden

First Post
Erekose13 said:
I'd rather see it that Learners would have to expend the power points when they learn this ability, meaning that they would have to have a power point pool to take advantage of it. That way there are no additional rules for this one ability.
Aye. They shouldn't be able to use this ability. If they can through some clause that allows them to ignore PP expenditures, that clause should be removed.
 

GnomeWorks

Adventurer
Erekose13 said:
I'd rather see it that Learners would have to expend the power points when they learn this ability, meaning that they would have to have a power point pool to take advantage of it. That way there are no additional rules for this one ability.

Well, there may be other abilities that require PP expenditure, as well. In the original draft, learners can learn abilities that require PP, but they simply ignore that particular requirement; I hadn't considered that the abilities could scale with additional PP.

Rystil Arden said:
Aye. They shouldn't be able to use this ability. If they can through some clause that allows them to ignore PP expenditures, that clause should be removed.

Why shouldn't they be allowed to use it? I think that expending talent slots is roughly analogous to expending PP; I see no problem with allowing the learner to use the ability. As the learner stands at the moment, it's broken, since the learner could simply use the ability to essentially gain infinite DR against with a single talent slot. Adding in the stipulation that the learner can use an ability that allows for scaling its effect by expending PP by spending more talent slots seems fair to me.
 

Rystil Arden

First Post
GnomeWorks said:
Well, there may be other abilities that require PP expenditure, as well. In the original draft, learners can learn abilities that require PP, but they simply ignore that particular requirement; I hadn't considered that the abilities could scale with additional PP.

As far as I'm concerned, by the RAW of what you wrote, the Learner can learn Resilience whether or not she has PP, and then she can use it to prevent up to 0 damage because she has no PP ;)

It would be like if the Learner stole an ability that said "Chilling Tentacles (Ex): All your tentacle attacks deal 2d6 extra cold damage" and didn't also steal something to give her tentacle attacks--she has Chilling Tentacles, but it doesn't do anything because she has no tentacles.

Why shouldn't they be allowed to use it? I think that expending talent slots is roughly analogous to expending PP; I see no problem with allowing the learner to use the ability. As the learner stands at the moment, it's broken, since the learner could simply use the ability to essentially gain infinite DR against with a single talent slot. Adding in the stipulation that the learner can use an ability that allows for scaling its effect by expending PP by spending more talent slots seems fair to me.
It's a clunky addition, and I don't think it makes any sense.

I think you are misconstruing the difference between abilities that require a Power Point reserve and abilities that require actually spending Power Points. It's fine to let the learners use abilities that normal require a PP reserve, but letting them use an ability that requires spending power points makes no sense. That said, since their slots are pretty valuable, the proposed 1 slot -> 1 PP is not overpowered.
 
Last edited:

GnomeWorks

Adventurer
Rystil Arden said:
As far as I'm concerned, by the RAW of what you wrote, the Learner can learn Resilience whether or not she has PP, and then she can use it to prevent up to 0 damage because she has no PP ;)

Hmm... a good call. I suppose that makes sense.

I think you are misconstruing the difference between abilities that require a Power Point reserve and abilities that require actually spending Power Points. It's fine to let the learners use abilities that normal require a PP reserve, but letting them use an ability that requires spending power points makes no sense. That said, since their slots are pretty valuable, the proposed 1 slot -> 1 PP is not overpowered.

I suppose you're right. If there is an ability a learner can learn that requires the expenditure of spell slots, the learner doesn't get to use talent slots as though they were spell slots; it should be the same in the case of PPs. They can have the ability, but unless they have the PP to power it, it's useless.

Nevermind, then. No need to change the learner.
 

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